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What's happening in DeSantistan 2.0

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by gator_lawyer, Jun 9, 2023.

  1. ursidman

    ursidman VIP Member

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    Bug Tussle NC
    For me it was Henry Miller’s Tropic of Cancer in 6th grade. Dunno where I got it but I haven’t been the same since.
     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2023
  2. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    I was wrong. It’s really two people who determine what others can read in Florida, two demented people. Reported before, and updated

    Of the roughly 1,100 complaints recorded in Florida since July 2022, more than 700 came from two counties — Escambia in the western Panhandle and Clay near Jacksonville. Together the two districts make up less than 3% of the state’s total public school enrollment.

    About 600 of the complaints came from two people — a Clay County dad and a Pensacola high school teacher.

    The data illustrates how a tiny minority of activists across the state can overwhelm school districts while shaping the national conversation over what books belong on school library shelves.


    Florida schools got hundreds of book complaints — mostly from 2 people
     
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  3. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    "Roomer" from a "reliable" source - DeSantis dropping out to run against Rick Scott. FWIW

     
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  4. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer VIP Member

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    This is repugnant:
    Florida reviewers of AP African American Studies sought ‘opposing viewpoints’ of slavery
    For example, a lesson in the Advanced Placement course focused on how Europeans benefited from trading enslaved people and the materials enslaved laborers produced. The state objected to the content, saying the instructional approach “may lead to a viewpoint of an ‘oppressor vs. oppressed’ based solely on race or ethnicity.”
    * * *
    “Enslaved African Americans had no wages to pass down to descendants, no legal right to accumulate property, and individual exceptions depended on their enslavers’ whims,” the College Board’s lesson plan said.

    When reviewing the content, however, state reviewers said the lesson plan might violate state laws and rules because it “supposes that no slaves or their descendants accumulated any wealth.”

    “This is not true and may be promoting the critical race theory idea of reparations,” state officials wrote in documents reviewed by the Herald/Times. “This topic presents one side of this issue and does not offer any opposing viewpoints or other perspectives on the subject.”
    -----------------------------------------------------------------
    There's a lot of other bad stuff in this article. The article confirms that these ghouls want to teach "both sides" of slavery.
     
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  5. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    I don’t have the words for those type of people. I feel disturbed just thinking of them out there
     
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  6. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    And in positions of power.
     
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  7. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    And then there is this. In an effort to blunt the benefits of the Inflation Reduction Act, DeSantis is refusing in Florida to take the money for the clean energy incentives. Leaving Florida consumers worse off, the climate worse off, and eliminating the benefits to the economy. Horrible human being. DeSantis tells Biden: Keep your IRA money
     
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  8. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    Weird that DeSantis is calling it Biden's money, when it is really money taken from Florida taxpayers.
     
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  9. ajoseph

    ajoseph Premium Member

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    Don’t forget, not only did he refuse the money’ it only does he reject clean energy initiatives, he ran to the far, disproportionate extreme by handing our free TAX BREAKS to gas stove manufacturers BECAUSE the gas was not as clean as electrical, thus rewarding the gas manufacturers, punishing electrical manufacturers and causing a competitive imbalance in the marketplace because of the tax breaks.

    Look at how he “wins.” Disgusting.
     
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  10. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    I just cannot get inside the head of those he is appealing to.
     
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  11. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Ancient oak tree may not survive at guvnr mansion.

    desi ...All good, more room for me and my kids to play baseball so it works for me.
     
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  12. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    At some point you would think this may actually piss off somebody that voted for him.

    I mean how stupid can voters be. First turn down Medicaid expansion money and now this.
     
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  13. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    Pay $100K to play a round of golf with DeSantis and get a rate hike. Give him a $30K golf game and get an advantageously located interstate interchange near your housing development.

     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2023
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  14. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    yeah, but he never backs down.
     
  15. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    Yeah we pay more for health care and solar panels, but finally somebody is airing the upside of slavery!!
     
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  16. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Jason Garcia tracks an amazing admission before the 11th Circuit by one of DeSantis attorneys. Not amazing in terms of revealing the true intent behind the STOP WOKE Act or how these people actually think. Only amazing in that what should be a very accomplished appellate advocate openly admitted to an obvious legal violation in response to a softball question from a sympathetic judge.


    I think the fact that DeSantis’ attorney felt comfortable just admitting an obviously illegal motivation behind the legislation is explained by a combination of two factors. First, they feel so comfortable before the 11th Circuit that they think it doesn't matter. DeSantis often will say that he knows he will win before the 11th Circuit. He is usually correct, but it puts those judges is in a very uncomfortable vision, one I'm sure they don't appreciate, as shown in this exchange. Second, I think it speaks to the insularity of the DeSantis team. They hang around so many similar thinking Hillsdale type individuals that they don't realize how ridiculous their beliefs sound when stated out loud before anyone outside that circle.



    Late in the hearing, one of the three judges presiding over the appeal — Judge Andrew Brasher, a Donald Trump appointee — began to press DeSantis’ lawyer on whether the Stop WOKE Act really is the least restrictive way to achieve the state’s goal of — as DeSantis himself said when he signed the law — saving people from having ideas “imposed” upon them “without their consent.”


    Ohlendorf: So I don’t think so, Judge Brasher. And I think this idea of whether the speech has caused some kind of mental distress is kind of a fiction created by the plaintiffs. There’s no indication that that is what the state was aiming at here. The state, I think, has an interest in protecting people from racist and offensive speech even if they would, misguidedly, welcome it. Now, here —

    Brasher: Really? Really? That’s interesting. So the state has an interest in protecting me from hearing things that I want to hear?

    Ohlendorf: I think so, your honor. I don’t see why whether the employee welcomes hearing that they are a morally inferior race goes to the state’s interest.


    This confession seemed to stun the judges. Another one on the panel — Judge Britt Grant, who, like Brasher, is a Trump appointee — jumped in to ask Ohlendorf about a landmark Supreme Court ruling from the 1970s that permitted Nazis to hold a public rally in a village where a large number of Holocaust survivors lived. Ohlendorf stammered for a moment and then went dead silent for a full 10 seconds while he tried to think of an answer.


    A lawyer for Ron DeSantis revealed the real motive behind one of Florida's most controversial laws
     
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  17. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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  18. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer VIP Member

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    I have to disagree. Let me make it plain that I am no fan of the Eleventh Circuit majority. They are awful in a lot of areas, particularly LGBTQ rights. But on free speech, they're usually decent. I would not call it comfort before the 11CA, as Grant and Wilson had beaten Ohlendorf up earlier in the argument on the First Amendment aspects of the case. I also would not say it's insularity.

    Simply put, they have a bad case. What DeSantis did was brazenly unconstitutional. What he was hoping for was that the Republican dominated courts would play stupid and just accept Florida's totally bullshit pretext (that this is an anti-discrimination law, not a speech code). Obviously, this panel wasn't playing stupid. And once that happens, the results aren't going to be pretty.

    Trust me, I've been before a hostile panel. Defending a good case is difficult when they're trying to goad you into telling them what they want to hear. Defending a bad case in front of a hostile panel can be straight up brutal. I watched Ed Carnes (a conservative 11CA judge from Alabama, no less) absolutely tear apart a DeSantis lawyer last year because he was forced into making bad arguments by another shitty DeSantis law.

    I'll also say that I wouldn't call this a softball question. Certainly, Ohlendorf knew the line of questioning was coming at some point. But it's a bad line of questioning for him. First, if the judge who is most favorable to you is asking you about whether you can win under strict scrutiny, you're in trouble (if you're the government). Second, it's simply a bad line of questioning for them, because this very obviously isn't the least restrictive means of preventing discrimination. And Brasher's question is basically saying that.

    FWIW, this is also not a great draw for DeSantis. Yes, the panel has two Trump appointees on it, but of the seven active Republican (six of which are Trump appointees), the three best (or least bad, at least) are Britt Grant (on the panel), Kevin Newsom, and Andrew Brasher (on the panel). (Although, I am still angry at Brasher over his awful opinion in the transgender healthcare case.) I consider those three far more reasonable than the other four (Luck, Branch, Lagoa, and Pryor). The two worst imo are Barbara Lagoa and Bill Pryor. The bad news for them (and good news for the rest of us) is if Brasher and Grant both rule against them, they know they can't win by going en banc.

    I will say, though, that I was disappointed by the panel on the vagueness claim. I think this law is very obviously unconstitutionally vague, but Brasher and Grant seemed inclined to go the opposite direction. Regardless, a win is a win. Hopefully, the panel for the higher-ed portion of the Stop WOKE Act comes to a similar conclusion on the First Amendment issues.
     
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  19. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    I will defer to you on such things. I probably was too quick to make assumptions on some of the larger issues.

    I will say two things I feel pretty confident on. First, despite the bad facts, a more competent appellate advocate would not have made such a damning admission. I still maintain that was jaw-dropping.

    Second, DeSantis routinely makes statements that any loss at the District Court level will be reversed at the 11th Circuit. That is also highly unusual for one of the litigants to make that statement is to essentially call the Court compromised, which I'm sure those judges do not appreciate.

    In terms of the particularities of the panel or all of the full court's history on related subjects, I certainly defer to you. But the way they bent over backwards on the felon disenfranchisement case to reach the obviously wrong result reinforce my existing cynicism. And while I have not been keeping strict score, I believe they have usually ruled the way that DeSantis predicts they will
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2023
  20. rivergator

    rivergator Too Hot Mod Moderator VIP Member

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    upload_2023-9-1_10-27-1.jpeg
     
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