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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Re above: not the time. That's Russia's way of trying to (a) see what the US has available in case of war, and (b) limit what the US has available. Because you know Russia will violate it.
     
  2. 1990Gator

    1990Gator VIP Member

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    Bill Maher Says It’s ‘Worth Asking’ Why Putin Didn’t Invade Ukraine Under Donald Trump


    From his monologue last night:

    The host dinged Biden for "dragging January 6th into this," then quoted the president when he said, "Look, how would you feel if you saw crowds storm and break down the doors of the British Parliament, kill five cops, injure 145? Or the German Bundestag? Or the Italian Parliament? I think you'd wonder."

    "OK, but if Putin thought Trump was really that supportive of him, why didn't he invade when Trump was in office?" Maher reacted. "It's at least worth asking that question if you're not locked into one intransigent thought."

    Careful Bill, the View will try to cancel you!
     
  3. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    It might be worth asking later. Lots of questions might be worth asking later. But right now the only question I have is, how do we return Ukraine to its January 2014 borders and remove Putin from office without escalating to nuclear warfare?
     
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  4. exiledgator

    exiledgator Gruntled

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    The answer, of course, is windmills.
     
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  5. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

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    It can be discussed, and the answer to that is fairly obvious. If you are Putin and playing the “long game” against the west by degrading the politics of the west. Why rock the boat for one of your greatest “achievements”? Invading Ukraine with force would have been a huge negative to Trumps re-election chances, even worse than his own failures as a leader. Putin’s ideal would have clearly just been to get a puppet regime back in place. Something he had until 2014. Ukraine was in a way “free” only from 2015-2021 after they ousted the Putin crony.

    It seems to me that Putin either lost his mind after losing his boy Trump, or figures time is running out (on his own life) to get this “reunification” with Ukraine done. Either Putin miscalculated the costs or doesn’t care what it does to his own people. It doesn’t seem to make much rational sense from the outside of Russia.
     
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  6. ncargat1

    ncargat1 VIP Member

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    Why should Putin invade Ukraine when Trump was single handedly destroying NATO for him??
     
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  7. gatorchamps960608

    gatorchamps960608 GC Hall of Fame

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    Trump was softening the ground in term 1 and Putin planned to go in during term 2. Thank God there was no term 2 for the orange fuhrer.
     
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  8. slocala

    slocala VIP Member

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    I am unable to find a link to the entire movie, but for the youngsters here, I highly recommend watching The Day After made for TV movie in its entirety. When this was broadcast in 1983, it was one of the most eye opening and clear depictions of the mutual destruction of our world. I hope our world leaders make the right decision.

     
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  9. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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  10. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    I knew they were trying to get involved in a ceasefire but didn't realize (or maybe I missed it) that the Pope himself went to the Russian embassy:

    "The Pope’s “unprecedented gesture” of visiting the Russian embassy to the Vatican the day after the invasion of Ukraine was a “personal step” in order to “express to the authorities in Moscow his concern about the escalation of the war,” Parolin said. War is “madness,” he said, and appealed to the “consciences” of all people involved to cease fighting immediately."

    (From a cnn live section)
     
  11. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    What a shame...from CNN live:

    "Flying on Russian planes is about to get much more dangerous

    From CNN's Chris Isidore

    "...Sanctions imposed by the United States and the European Union mean that the world's two major aircraft makers, Boeing (BA) and Airbus (EADSF), can no longer supply spare parts or maintenance support for Russian airlines. The same is true of jet engine makers.

    "Within a year Russia will cease to have any kind of viable airline industry," said Richard Aboulafia, managing director of AeroDynamic Advisory.

    He said the country's airline industry could soon find itself somewhere between the heavily sanctioned industries in Iran and North Korea.
    ...
    Russia is the world's largest nation by landmass, more than twice the size of the continental United States. It needs to have a viable airline industry to keep its economy working, said Charles Lichfield, the deputy director of GeoEconomics Center at the Atlantic Council, an international think tank."
     
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  12. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    From CNN live

    "French and German leaders urge immediate ceasefire in call with Putin

    From CNN's Nadine Schmidt in Berlin

    German Chancellor Olaf Scholz and French President Emmanuel Macron urged Russian President Vladimir Putin to call an immediate ceasefire in Ukraine during a 75-minute call on Saturday.

    Macron and Scholz also appealed to Putin to “move toward a diplomatic solution to the conflict,” according to German government spokesperson Steffen Hebestreit.

    He said the conversation was part of ongoing international efforts to end the war in Ukraine. The two sides agreed not to disclose any further details of the talks, he added."
     
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  13. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Cryptocurrency won't save Vladimir Putin - CNNPolitics

    "Is cryptocurrency a way around sanctions?
    WHAT MATTERS: One way Russia will try to find its way around sanctions is in bitcoin and other forms of cryptocurrency. How would that work?
    PRASAD: Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies do not yet provide the scalability to evade financial sanctions at the level of an entire economy, especially in view of the need to ultimately convert cryptocurrencies into more widely accepted global currencies to make international payments. In other words, the Russian government cannot count on bitcoin to evade sanctions -- after all, payments for international transactions still need to be settled in real money such as dollars or euros. Furthermore, cryptocurrencies cannot in any significant way prevent a country's currency from collapsing in value relative to major reserve currencies since those values are determined in formal financial markets."
     
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  14. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Nice display of Western forces exercises, likely prescheduled but nonetheless timely

     
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  15. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Great read. Some of his conclusions contradict other credible analysis, but obviously well informed and credible and certainly thought provoking

    The Weakness of the Despot
     
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  16. PITBOSS

    PITBOSS GC Hall of Fame

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    very powerful at the time and still a top 20 TV show in ratings. It supposedly had a impact on President Reagan.
     
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  17. ncargat1

    ncargat1 VIP Member

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    Truman has been deployed to the entrance of the Black Sea since January. Previously engaged in NATO navy exercises with Italy, Norway. Four additional destroyers left the East Coast of the US in February to join the NATO carrier group which includes 4 other US destroyers, a US guided missile frigate, now 2 Norwegian war ships and an Italian carrier named the Cavour which has an air wing of the F-35Bs.
     
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  18. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    Remember that Trump Gave Ukraine military aid. And then he had his call with Zelensky and tried to stop the aid. In the call, he implicitly threatened it and then he stopped the aid alleging corruption. Looking back, one has to ask what his motive was. If Russia attacked during that climate, Trump’s chances of re-election. Would have been substantially disminished.
     
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  19. PITBOSS

    PITBOSS GC Hall of Fame

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  20. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Try it...please...because realistically the only way to stop the supplies is in Poland before crossing the border & getting disbursed. So they'd have to attack Poland. Cnn live:

    "Russia sends warning to the US about transferring weapons to Ukraine, according to state media

    From CNN’s Maija Ehlinger

    Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Ryabkov warned the United States about the potential consequences of transferring weapons to Ukraine, saying convoys with foreign weapons would be "legitimate targets."

    Ryabkov made these comments on Saturday on the state-run Channel One, according to Russia’s state-owned RIA Novosti news agency.

    "We warned the United States that pumping Ukraine with weapons from a number of countries orchestrated by them is not just a dangerous move, but these are actions that turn the corresponding convoys into legitimate targets," he added."
    .....

    As to legitimate targets, they've hit a medical center, a preschool, and apartments today among other things, so I don't really think they care about what constitutes a "legitimate target".