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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. CaptUSMCNole

    CaptUSMCNole Premium Member

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    They were not cautious early on. The RGF actually chose an incredibly aggressive Course of Action for the initial invasion of Ukraine and through incompetent planning and execution, the AFU were able to repel them. Russia does not have real 5th GEN fighters seeing as they are way behind on stealth and radar technology. Shocking that crappy Russian Air Defense technology can pick up crappy Russian fighter technology but neither can do that against US tech.

    The US has fight a war like this, it was called Desert Storm and OIF Round 1. You put US military up against whatever conventional forces Russia or Ukraine had prior to Feb '22 and you would get the same result as Desert Storm. The AFU is fighting the best of the RGF to a standstill with our cast offs and 1990's technology. The F-16 that were just donated have been in service for almost 50 years.
     
  2. CaptUSMCNole

    CaptUSMCNole Premium Member

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    You do know that SecDef Austin, NSA Sullivan, and SecState Blinken have been talking with their Russian counterparts over the last 2 1/2 half years, correct?
     
  3. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Not according to Russia. According to Russia, Austin’s call (a couple of months ago?) was the first it had heard, from a high-ranking US official, in over two years.
     
  4. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Russia may well have suffered setbacks in the early weeks of the war, but during that time it had forced Ukraine to the table during which time Russia withdrew from Kyiv, as a good faith gesture. This gained currency, in Western circles, as Ukraine defeating Russia in “The Battle of Kyiv.”

    F-22’s and F-35’s would fall flaming from the skies if they flew over Ukraine with impunity.
     
  5. CaptUSMCNole

    CaptUSMCNole Premium Member

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    Not true:
    Nov 2022
    https://www.wsj.com/articles/senior...closed-talks-with-top-putin-aides-11667768988
    March 2023
    https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/02/politics/antony-blinken-sergey-lavrov-g20/index.html
    Feb 2024
    https://mid.ru/en/foreign_policy/news/1798518/
    Jun 2024
    Pentagon head speaks with Russian counterpart for first time in a year

    Those are official engagements and not back channel ones.
     
  6. CaptUSMCNole

    CaptUSMCNole Premium Member

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    Please tell me how Russia forced Ukraine to the table by pulling out of Kyiv?

    Well the second part of that sentence is correct, so you are starting to get there.
     
  7. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  8. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Totally understand all of that. Speaking for self, I count on President Trump doing what he thinks suits his own interest (but conflating that with the national interest). As I have laid out, I think if he truly wants to end the war as quickly as possible, he will see a more successful path to the quickest plausible ending via pressuring Russia, not Ukraine. There are too many of the people he needs for more important goals who will not acquiesce to cutting off Ukraine, and trying to strangle off Ukraine would not effectively pressure Ukraine as well as many of the other things Trump could do to Russia. Of course, he has not asked for my opinion. We will see.
     
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  9. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    Israel had a lot of help tak8ng out Iranian missiles. US planes and destroyers, Jordan, the UK, France

    I've heard many military experts say that Russia has the best air defenses in the world. Never heard a realexpert say that the US has the best defenses. Russia has the badass surface to surface missiles that terrify our military.

    The US army is weak and would be defeated by the Russians (per Andrei Martyanov).
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2024 at 3:23 PM
    • Funny Funny x 1
  10. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Israel’s latest ‘attack’ on Iran was likely a face-saving negotiated pin prick.
     
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  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Of course it’s likely higher, possibly MUCH higher. Why else would our State Department be pressuring Ukraine to lower its conscription age to 18? And prior to that, why would elderly men and young women be fighting on the frontlines ?

     
  12. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    While Isreal (intentionally) did relatively little damage to Iran on the ground I wouldn't call taking out the Islamic Republic's air defense system a pin prick. The message from Israel was that next time it could be much worse.
    Israel took out primary Iranian air defenses, left it ‘essentially naked’ – report
    Israel Struck Air Defenses Around Critical Iranian Energy Sites, Officials Say
    Israel's Attack On Iran Has Left Tehran Offensively And Defensively Weaker
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  13. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Links noted. Will you note that they are much disputed ? I can post the contrary links. Only takes a few seconds to find them.
     
  14. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    It's been suggested that one of the reasons Hezbollah agreed to the ceasefire and withdrawal in Lebanon was that it could no longer count on indefinite and nearly unlimited support from Iran, a direct consequence of the Israeli attack.
     
  15. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Just so. It was an ancient diplomatic-military message first attributed to Sun Tzu circa the 6th Century BCE, which we abbreviate today as FAFO. I note that Iran has not FAd since to FO what Israel might do next time.
     
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  16. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    That’s quite a leap I would say. Iran reportedly has thousands of missiles (and air defense systems) tucked away in its vast nuke-hardened underground facilities.

    Some accounts had Iran secreting prized assets prior to the last Israeli strike. This would lend credence to reports that the attack was negotiated and amounted to a nothingburger.

    Truth is we don’t know who, between Israel and Hezbollah, cried uncle. FWIW, 61% of Israelis believe they’ve lost the war.

    If the case, that’s the third defeat Hezbollah has inflicted on Israel since 2006.
     
  17. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    That is a possibility. Unfortunately, we will not know the whole truth on that for a while if ever. And in the mean, people will read exactly want they want to read:

    “It was clearly Israel’s show of force.”

    “Nonsense. It was a diplomatic coup by Jake Sullivan, who would have made Ikenberry’s dream of peace and love breaking out all over the world if he had just been given four more years.”

    “Bullshit! It was because the Iranians knew that Trump was coming back to town, and they know if they don’t start behaving, Trump is going to turn their shithole country into a parking lot with balls of fire from his eyes and bolts of lightning from his ass!”

    “It’s the third prophesied sign that you-know-who is coming back … Elvis!”
     
  18. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    That was my recollection per what I heard from Greg Copley on the John Batchelor show. Wasn't positive and didn't feel like looking it up.
     
  19. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Russia’s fearsome S-400 air-defense system isn’t quite living up to the hype in Ukraine – Missile Defense Advocacy Alliance
    https://coffeeordie.com/wagner-group-syria-khasham
     
  20. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    More excellent insight from the blog Moon of Alabama:

    How The New Russian Missiles Are Changing The Game

    To describe a weapon system as a game changer on the battlefield is always open to be ridiculed. Many of the weapon systems that have been delivered to Ukraine were called game changing but failed to make any difference in the outcome of that war.

    So why did I call the new Russian Oreshnik missile a 'game changer'?
    https://www.moonofalabama.org/2024/11/how-the-new-russian-missiles-are-changing-the-game.html1

    One Oreshnik missile carries 36 warheads and reportedly took out a 1 square mile underground nuclear facility recently as I posted on this thread yesterday.