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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    It's a mix I'm sure. The policy right now is Ukrainians first. Inherently that's going to cause problems. The example someone used about a white girl being let on after they pulled an African girl out...was the white girl Ukranian? If the answer is yes, then doesnt matter the skin color, rules are rules. Also, they should be angry at their own governments for not arranging evacuations and basically telling them they were on their own. That's not racism, that's negligence on their home countries.

    And yes the other countries opened their doors to Ukranian refugees. Fair or not, these are technically refugees from Ghana, India, etc (there are Hispanics too being held back), so there may not be agreements in place to take them.

    There should be a centralized location with tents, etc, to process those who aren't Ukranian so they're not sitting ducks in the cities. That way they can get food, medical care, etc, while they wait to get home. The issue is the sheer scale and how many people are coming.

    Let Ghana & others send consular staff to the border to process their citizens.
     
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  2. Swamplizard

    Swamplizard VIP Member

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    Bombing Ukraine like WW2 wouldn't be cost effective and if you use nukes it is unlivable and unusable, you have to take it conventionally and Russia's army, mostly made up of conscript troops who have only trained for 12 months. Ukraine is fighting for it's freedom this isn't a winnable situation for Russia
     
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  3. rivergator

    rivergator Too Hot Mod Moderator VIP Member

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    Russian climate delegate apologizes on Ukraine, saying many ’fail to find any justification for the attack'
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/clim...nBbehAcuB-Qne2pTPHFyS227VxmZWT_7QXydh7QXck_TI
     
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  4. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

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    • Agree Agree x 9
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  5. 92gator

    92gator GC Hall of Fame

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  6. RealGatorFan

    RealGatorFan Premium Member

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    Just by attacking them he already lost them. I don't think he cares one bit about his approval rating.
     
  7. WC53

    WC53 GC Hall of Fame

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    Think he was counting on a Ukrainian military coup to do that for him. Best laid plans…..
     
  8. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    Tell me where I wrote Putin is justified in what he did. What I wrote is I can understand his reaction and why. There is no need to spin what I wrote to suit your belief. Putin feels justified in what he has done and that is all that matters at this point.

    Putin feeling pain is not going to stop him at this point. He hasn't pulled out yet and he isn't going to pull out anytime soon. Keep in mind what ever you throw at Putin we all feel the pain. He is still trading oil and the world is happy to pay for it. Watch what happens if he cuts off the spigot in the dead of winter.

    And what were Putin's demands in today's talks - Ukraine becoming part of NATO is militarization
    • Recognition of Russian sovereignty over Crimea
    • Demilitarization and denazification of Ukrainian state
    • Ensuring neutral status of Ukraine
    What Did Putin Mean by ‘Denazification’ of Ukraine and Why is It so Important?

    Here's an article that states my position much better as it seems I'm not getting through to you. I think it's time for people to wake up.
    The War in Ukraine Is Putin's Fault, but 30 Years of Misguided U.S. Foreign Policy Didn't Help

    If expansion is creating the very conditions that NATO's existence is supposed to prevent, it's not working. Yet every single U.S. president since the end of the Cold War has misunderstood this. And now here we are.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2022
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  9. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Let’s not forget, this deep into the Winter War against Finland, things looked much the same. Eventually, the Soviet Union was able to get it together and start using its superior numbers to lean on Finland and smother them into an unequal truce. Ukraine is fighting hard, but from a purely military perspective, time is on the side of the Russians.
     
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  10. gogator7444

    gogator7444 GC Hall of Fame

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    Well I'll be...guess Putin is truly a savior by bombing Ukraine & trying to annex it by force. He's actually trying to save Ukraine and make it a more equal, tolerant society. Who knew?
     
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  11. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    Agreed Ukraine is not a member of NATO and Ukraine has been asking for membership since 2004. They have also asked for membership into the EU which was denied. Certain economic benchmarks must be met to become a member of the EU and I'm sure the Ukraine's involvement in corruptible practices had something to do with the denial.
     
  12. mdgator05

    mdgator05 Premium Member

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    From a purely military standpoint, that is true. But they announced that the markets are closed again tomorrow and they are continuing to lose assets left and right (and the Rouble lost 30% more of its value even after they doubled interest rates in one day, while the Central Bank has very limited options for propping it up). The population appears to already not be thrilled with this and as the economic situation worsens, it might get worse. Even the oligarchs are starting to speak out a bit. Delay is a smart strategy as Russia is gutted internally.
     
  13. exiledgator

    exiledgator Gruntled

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    Russia has a long history of starting wars chaotically and disorganized.

    - Dan Carlin

    Don't see anything different here in that sense.

    The red army could obviously roll up Ukraine if they choose. 1 rifle for every two men. Blocking units. Classic Russian stuff. But will their society (and oligarchs) put up with the costs?

    190k Russian style ain't gonna get it done. We all knew that.
     
  14. dingyibvs

    dingyibvs Premium Member

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    It's important to understand your enemy's motivations and goals, I agree with you that attempting to understand them is not the same as justifying their behavior.
     
  15. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

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    What in the fresh H E double hockey sticks is undiplomatic activities?

     
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  16. WC53

    WC53 GC Hall of Fame

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    Spying, lying and assassinations oh my ;)
     
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  17. g8rjd

    g8rjd GC Hall of Fame

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    I had a feeling it was espionage. These details are going to be something else.
     
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  18. defensewinschampionships

    defensewinschampionships GC Hall of Fame

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    Delay is the grandest of strategies in this case. They will eventually open the Russian Markets. When they do, all hell will break loose.
     
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  19. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    The world as myself doesn't feel Putin's invasion into the Ukraine is justified. Putin feels it's justified and he has his reasons for it. Being deaf tone to those reasons is why we are where we are today. NATO encroaching on Russia only adds fuel to the fire.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2022
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  20. OklahomaGator

    OklahomaGator Jedi Administrator Moderator VIP Member

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    After 9/11 which if I remember correctly was on a Tuesday, I don't believe we reopened the stock market until the following Monday. Of course the twin towers were just blocks from Wall Street.
     
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