Trump's Troubles

Likely? Come on. If you can’t call it what it is you’re no better than the shills. Stop equivocating. It’s not like we don’t have the info to call him what he is.

 

Agree 100%. I make an effort and rarely slip and use terms like that.

But to say someone is "shilling for a criminal", or referring to a racist or un-American person as such......that's not name calling.

And however you want to call it; someone intentionally LYING about an attack on our Capitol, or the racist lies of a major politician....the deserve condemnation. To have it called out in some way.

 

Oh apologies. I have been reading too much philosophy of science lately, where fallibilism comes off my keyboard without me thinking about it.

 

I’ve got the hateful 8 and the Russian troll on ignore. Can’t do it to all of them it’s important to understand what the lunatic junta is up to.

 

I agree that legal rulings need to be accepted. I don’t think each of us must agree with them though. Look at the way the liberals reacted to overturning Roe. They never said, “Oh the Supreme Court ruled, so I guess we were wrong on abortions.” Instead they suggested the Supreme Court was biased. I think this is fine. The trouble comes when some literally reject the legal outcome, as seemingly occurred on 1/6. That is not ok. Personally I think the court was wrong to uphold DeSantis’ silencing of Disney as legal. I am probably not going to have my mind changed on this, even if Disney’s appeal fails. However, if their appeal did fail, I would not try to overthrow the state government. Instead, I’d just move on, pushing for what I think is a more fair tomorrow.

 

Perhaps I am as bad of a person as you are suggesting, or perhaps we have more of a semantic issue. Again, like most scientists, I think our knowledge is fallible. I especially think that the beliefs of any single individual, including myself, are fallible. Things are legal if our legal system says they are. I am happy to accept any legal outcome of the Trump cases, because these judges and juries are the true authorities here - not some random message board yahoo like myself. Personally, I think Trump is absolutely unacceptable as a presidential candidate, but clearly not everyone is seeing this issue the same way.

 

Fraud is a crime, even if you pay off the loan.

See how easy that is?

 

You seem unstable sometimes. I understand you don’t agree with the 10 percent or so on this board. But you appear to have a real hatred towards them. Kind of sad

 

I just don't care for un-American traitors.

Btw, your choice of a moniker is rather sad, Snatchmagnet.

 

Unhinged, as per usual, but do appreciate the advice.

 

I'm pretty sure he has his poles reversed.

 

sheesh fragile people…… did not say you are a bad person. It’s just that there no gray with Trump..

 

Been lending for 14 years now. I take a yearly law and ethics class which includes going over cases.

Never once have I seen someone charged with fraud because they gave their opinion on the value of their property.
I have never been told its fraud to do so.

Now calling an appraiser to try and get them to change the value is fraud.

You are allowed to have an opinion on the value of your property.

Banks have and always will due their own due diligence on the values of property being used for collateral.

If we went by the standard you want to use, every person who ever did a cash-out refinance would be guilty of this when the appraised value comes in lower.

Fraud is when you provide false documents to show different levels of income or false bank statements. It's people who call appraisers to try and convince them to change the value. If he called the appraiser to try and use different square footage for the property, that would be a fraud. Simply telling a bank what his opinion at application for any given property is not fraud.

 

Which is obviously not all Trump did. Stop trying to mislead.

 

Come on man you know this goes way beyond someone's opinion. They submitted fraudulent documents which is the exact definition of fraud that you just provided

 

How so?

Did he do anything else other than saying what he thinks the value of his properties are?

Did he try to get an appraiser to use a different value?
Did he try to get an appraiser to use comps that otherwise would not normally be used?
Did he try to mislead the appraiser on square footage?

Now submitting documents to show different levels of income or debt is fraud.
Even if he paid off the loans in full, it's still fraud if he submitted falsified documents.

Someone here mentioned something about two sets of books but I have not looked into it myself.

 

Umm, I have mentioned MANY times the past two days that IF he supplied false documents on income or debts, that would be fraud.
I clearly stated many times that its not fraud to submit a loan application with your opinion on a property value.

 

LOL.

Trump Organization CFO Allen Weisselberg testifies he kept two sets of books

Trump Organization CFO testifies he kept two sets of books

 

Cmon man. He submitted allegedly audited financial statements that turned out to be fraudulent. Yes, banks do their due diligence to protect themselves and their funds but ultimately the buck stops with the applicant who should be providing accurate information.

You're acting as if this was simple home loan where someone claimed their home was worth 3x the market. Clearly in that scenario the bank would sniff that out because it's a pretty simple transaction. These loans for Trump were much more complex where the bank would put significant weight on the representations from the Trump organization CFO and auditors (who it turns out the Trump org was
lying to).