Three kids killed by shooter at Christian school

stop it. you cannot secure every soft target where people gather. malls, airports, train stations, community events, sports stadiums etc. the problem of mass shootings is not limited to schools

 

Problem is these events are not restricted to schools. ( restaurants, grocery stores, malls, churches, flea markets, concert venues, parades etc... are we somehow going to secure all those too? )

 

The TSA protects airports where in many cases 10’s of millions of passengers go through every year and where 1 successful bomber getting through means several hundred lives lost. The resources also come from ticket sales. How the heck do you think this is comparable?

Schools are underfunded as-is, in many cases buildings in disrepair, where do you think the $$$ comes from? Certainly new schools should be built with increased security in mind or perhaps have gated access if possible, but for the most part you are talking many hundred of billions in new funding just to retrofit for security, and that’s just the fixed costs of improvements before you get into the annual costs if you want to have multiple armed security officers present at every single school (which is what it would take to “secure” every school).

My idea has been that towns should basically have a firehouse and police station attached to or next door to every school. At least then you are sort of pooling resources rather than needing separate security forces just for schools.

 

Sadly true wrt to overturning but Chief Justice Warren Burger had it right on how we should interoperate it We can highly regulate it

 

agree with 100% of what you said at bottom. There are absolutely knuckle draggers around. I sparred with a guy. Big dude. 230lb. Neck tatts and all he talked about was loving to F people up. Needless to say as a practitioner there was zero upside for me to train with him. I basically defended, countered when he overextended and ran out the clock until the spar was over and walked away. I very much appreciate the respect aspect of training. Respecting your partner. Respecting your instructor/ coach etc. I spend more time as a striker than rolling around but enjoy both. I’ve been with highly skilled BJJ guys with 15+ years and always great to work on stuff with them. Shake hands and part ways respectfully

 

There is no right answer. In traffic accidents we know they are going to happen and that people are going to get killed, but we pass laws to make sure everyone is old enough to drive, is taught to drive, is tested by both written and road tests, is licensed to drive, that signs limiting speeds are posted, you’re not under the influence and your seat belt is fastened. All those things save lives.

Here’s an idea, let’s ask the cops what they think should be done.

 

I don't know and it's a decent question, but the answer doesn't change the fact that the carnage was less here than at Parkland, Sandy Hook, Uvalde, Vegas, Walmart, etc.

 

It's a starting point but it isn't the solution in and of itself. I would note that in the case of the Nashville shooter her parents expressed the opinion that she shouldn't own firearms and that she was already receiving therapy for a mental disorder.
Nashville school shooter hid guns in parents' house

The shooter who killed six people at a school in Nashville, Tennessee, on Monday bought seven guns legally and hid them at home, police say. Investigators say the suspect's parents felt the 28-year-old should not own weapons, and did not realise the guns had been concealed in their house. Six people, including three children age nine, were killed in the attack at the Covenant School. The suspect was under "doctor's care for an emotional disorder", police say.​

 

It’s a good debate. What about the guy who was married and comes home to find his wife left him for yoga instructor. He’s blind sided and devastated. Based on friends he seeks out a therapist. During the course of next 6 month she gives him Xanax to assist in working though his loss. A year later he’s Great and dating someone knew. The question comes up “ have you ever been under mental health care for depression and or anxiety ?” The guy has moved on. His profession and personal life are great. Should he be barred from owning a pistol ? What about a parent who grieved the loss of a child or loved one in a boating accident and for a short period was working with a psychiatrist and took anti anti anti anxiety meds to sleep. A year later they are much better but when asked they have to answer yes they have been under mental health care

 

I think the resistance you encountered was due to your insistence upon one type of solution, which is ironic given the rest of your post. Sure, you will claim it wasn't your only proposed solution, but we have yet to read where you've addressed the gun problem.

 

No, it's a deep dive that covers a broad base of factors that make a person who they are today. It was not an insistence upon one idea, it was a suggestion of a deviation from where people continue to bang their heads against one another on gun control vs. no gun control (I've said multiple times that people are welcome to continue pushing for gun restriction measures). The mental health aspect of it was one small area of what I originally mentioned that caught l_boy's attention, but it was a far cry from the only utility that could come from the data that needs to be exploited.

Like I said, you see this as a gun problem, and I have no problem with that. I see this as a problem where humans have a desire and will to execute other humans, that's a problem with the mind that I think we (as a collective) can do better with in our country. Your focus is on the mechanism (again, no problem with that), my interest is in the mind and things we do to shape it.

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One correction:

What the data says about gun deaths in the U.S.

Maybe it's increased since then, but 2020 was not low.

One thing I keep thinking is that guns have been around longer than we've been a country. Even after the UT tower shooter, mass shootings were few and far between. [BTW, one of my brother's HS friends was at the tower shortly before the shooter started firing.] What has changed in our culture that people now think it is acceptable to make random strangers pay for their pain? Solve this and we solve these sick mass shootings.

 

In those instances they should be allowed, but I said Quote “suffering from anxiety or depression.” I didn’t say “suffered,” so if they’re no longer suffering, and their lives are great then I don’t think anyone would have a problem.

 

Which is why treating gun ownership more like car ownership as policy makes a lot of sense when considering how regulation of cars has reduced child death rates while not restricting car ownership, and the lack of sound policies and regulation around guns has increase child death rates. There can be similar regulation around guns that make the US safer for everyone and still respect the SA, it's not an either/or proposition, but the NRA spins it that way.

Children and teens are more likely to die by guns than anything else | CNN

 

IOW you project the acknowledgement of a gun problem onto others while refusing to accept it, instead seeking other "solutions," which are little more than a distraction. Meanwhile, the problem is right in front of you.

 

I would argue that the airport was a police state if it became mandatory for me to be there for seven hours a day, five days a week. Its odd in a thread where people are complaining about freedoms taken away are seeking to turn our schools into prisons.

I have three kids in school and, yes, their safety is my biggest concern. The logistics of securing the schools like an airport do not seem feasible. When considering my daughter's high school and how it could be properly secured more so than it already is and similar to the Nashville School where the latest shooting has taken place, I see two options.

1) Everyone shows up to a particular building, goes through a security check every morning, and they have to stay in the building until they leave at the end of the day. You know, like an airport. No switching buildings. No outdoor time. No cafeteria as those would compromise the security checks and leave kids vulnerable in the outdoor setting which could be approached by a gunman in any direction.

2) A prison style fortress. Full perimeter fencing which could not be crossed. Guards. Full security check of anyone or any vehicle entering the grounds. This would allow outdoor activities and moving building to building, but within the confines of a secured perimeter.

I am not really sure that either option is great for the mental well being of the kids, though.

It also doesn't touch on all the other activities that would need to be protected: sporting events, daycares, malls, playgrounds, community pools, summer camps, etc.

 

Honestly, just ignore my posts on the gun threads. You aren't interested in a genuine discussion, and you take my words in the worst possible meaning. Seriously, where do you come up with this nonsense? I'm not interested in the silly games.

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I'm a bit confused myself. I feel like a couple of our more objective members are reading your comments wrong unless I'm mistaken myself. I read your comments as everything is fair game and no stone should go unturned in looking at the problem. I don't see more regulation as excluded from your viewpoint unless as I said before I'm the one mistaken.

 

No, you are right on. I'm 100% not opposed to new gun legislation. I admit to being ignorant of the possible ramifications, and I find that part of the discussion at least somewhat interesting. I'm not a gun owner, and I don't believe I ever will be one. Everything is fair game, for solutions talk, I just don't have much to add to the gun control (vs. no gun control) aspect of things.

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