Three kids killed by shooter at Christian school

To a reasonable person making ammo WAY less available is extremely effective. Even though you may not be a reasonable person (I pass no judgement) you know it to be very effective, it’s born out in first world countries, of which we will soon no longer be a member o.

 

Sorry, off topic, but . . .

Getting to the Macon Symphony and Beyond - Let's Go!

 

Because we have deeper issues in my opinion. I think the materialistic society that we live in as American's may be worse than other places. I think the bullying and cruelty may be worse here. No proof, just an assumption I gain from folks I talk to from other cultures.

Make no mistake. I really hate the gun culture and think we need much stricter laws to keep weapons out of the hands of the aforementioned groups, but I think guns are a symptom of a broken culture.

 

Ah well the exception proves the point..

 

The US market consumes more than 12 billion rounds of commercially produced ammo per year.

The idea that “you can buy 25 rounds per year” is a remotely workable idea, or a reasonable change, is absurd.

 

Actually, almost everyone is saying "Do Nothing" because we are well past the point where the two parties can compromise and find common sense. We are that point of Trump/Biden-politics where it is "My way, or not at all".

 

12B, That’s the absurd part. Works in other countries, let’s face it it’s not worth replying to me on this because you are clearly in the do nothing crowd. I’m still going to keep offering reasonable suggestions though.

 

What would you do? Nothing? Arm everyone? I see lots of people objecting to potential solutions without offering any alternatives

 

So, your position is the millions of responsible, law abiding gun owners who hunt or engage in competitive or recreational range shooting must be penalized because non gun owners are incapable of identifying and successfully treating those mentally ill individuals likely to commit mass shooters?

 

I’ve said on the previous mass shooting threads that I think there’s a gap that needs correcting in the prohibited person laws regarding mental health.

How exactly you fix that without discouraging people who need mental assistance from being willing to seek it out is tricky - as is how you ensure due process in applying that prohibition, but mass shooters who have previously been institutionalized or are actively being treated for fairly severe mental illnesses being able to purchase a gun at retail is troubling.

Solutions that are intended primarily just to make it difficult to own a gun generally, however, are non-starters for me. No one would think that “you can buy one small ink cartridge and one ball point pen per year, if you want to write more than that you can go to a government-licensed printing facility” would pass First Amendment muster, nor would “you can own guns, but you can only buy less than one box of ammo per year” pass Second Amendment muster.

 

Ah yes, the typical smart ass response when u have no intelligent response. Classy.

 

As is the case in a lot of policy, you have to make judgment calls balancing freedom and security interests.

One way of preventing all car accidents is banning all cars, but that's nonsensical and places an absurd burden on everyone.

That's an extreme example, but it gets the point across.

 

Yup just like we place reasonable restrictions on the sale of alcohol, C4 p, icigarettes and Sudafed to name a few. We even had limits on Baby formula and in many places it’s placed behind the counter.

 

Well then great news, we’ve already implemented your reasonable limits.

Like with cigarettes and alcohol, you have to be 18 to buy long gun ammo and 21 to buy handgun ammo (18 USC 922(b)(1)). And in many places it’s even kept behind the counter!

 

The same people on this forum make the same excuses why nothing can or should be done about gun violence... masked in hyperbole, fantasy and distraction. Like @Gatorrick22's red herring that the transgendered are the source of mass gun violence in America.

Rinse and repeat. And people die.

 

I can buy as much alcohol, as many cigarettes, Sudafed as I want, when I want. I can even enjoy the convenience of order from my phone for home delivery.

I believe the limitations on on baby formula were due to supply chain issues and location specific. If one wanted to spend the time, they could visit as many stores as possible and purchase formula.

WRT to C4, are you referring to a Corvette, energy supplement drink, or an explosive?

 

What's wrong with requiring enhanced background checks and additional training like Canada, Switzerland, Norway, France, Italy, etc

 

Because the devil’s in the details of what those things mean.

And most gun owners’ experience suggest that they’ll be implemented in a way that is primarily intended just to be a burden rather than to actually accomplish anything substantively in and of themselves (see, for example, the NFA “background check” process that is little different from a NICS check that a gun store can run in 5 minutes combined with a fingerprint background check that the FBI can run for employment in an hour or two, but ATF somehow manages to take somewhere between 2 months and 2 years to accomplish).

 

So let perfection kill good? Multiple countries around the world have systems that work but US can't do anything because it might not work? So easy to say just do nothing because it might not work but that isn't working

 

Thank you for posting this chart. I am glad to see the numbers of people killed by drunk drivers have come down. I agree with those measures and perhaps if they had been implemented sooner, my cousin would still be alive.

Some things jump out from this chart and your post. The rate of deaths has leveled out at about 3.2/100,000 population. That's about 10,000+ per year. That seems to say that our society accepts 10,000+ dead per year for the pleasure of consuming alcoholic beverages. Is that something you are good with?

One thing about your list of measures implemented to bring down deaths -- increased penalty laws, random checks, education, held bars responsible for over serving -- is the measures did not include any ban on any type of alcohol. Should we explore that? Maybe a ban on hard liquor, for example, whiskey, vodka, gin, and tequila. No one needs those. Let them enjoy beer and wine but ban the hard stuff. This is one of the main arguments made about guns, so why not use the same argument here to save lives? Of course, it will never happen because too many people enjoy the pleasure of drinking the hard stuff.

It's also useful to put the numbers in context. From a Pew Research study: "The Gun Violence Archive, an online database of gun violence incidents in the U.S., defines mass shootings as incidents in which four or more people are shot, even if no one was killed (again excluding the shooters). Using this definition, 513 people died in these incidents in 2020." The population in 2020 was 329.5 million. That works out to a rate of 0.156/100,000. The chance of being killed by a drunk driver is 20.6 times greater than being killed by a mass shooter. Yet in all my years on GC, I don't think I've ever seen a thread started by people outranged about children killed by drunk drivers.

I know more people are killed with guns than just mass shootings. However, I think what scares people calling for gun control the most is the apparent randomness of these types of shootings, like children in schools. A large number of non-mass shootings are people who know each other, or gang violence, or other situations that the most of us never have to worry about.