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Netanyahu tells Israel ‘We are at war’ after Hamas launches an unprecedented attack, killing at leas

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by Gatorrick22, Oct 7, 2023.

  1. gatormonk

    gatormonk GC Hall of Fame

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  2. fredgarvin

    fredgarvin Senior

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    sxQ88uW.jpg
     
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  3. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    If we are going to maintain the analogy, the authorities could take you down, but only losing 2-3 cops. I know we are over 20 years since Gen. Van Ripper’s red team (from memory), but my open source understanding is that we cannot keep it open without losses. Drone swarms, ASMs, motor boat swarms and all that.

    Hope I’m wrong if tested. Not like we have not advanced, but not sure right now about AEGIS and the like against swarms.

    And either way, spot crude y axis will have to be extended to fit.
     
  4. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Never trust memory. Van Riper. Sure you know about this, more than I, but the part of the board that has no professional interest and is not weird like me.

    At the start of MC ’02, to fulfill the forced-entry requirement, blue issued red an eight-point ultimatum, of which the final point was surrender. Red team leader Van Riper knew his country’s political leadership could not accept this, which he believed would lead the blue forces to directly intervene. Since the George W. Bush administration had recently announced the “preemption doctrine,” Van Riper decided that as soon as a U.S. Navy carrier battle group steamed into the Gulf, he would “preempt the preemptors” and strike first. Once U.S. forces were within range, Van Riper’s forces unleashed a barrage of missiles from ground-based launchers, commercial ships, and planes flying low and without radio communications to reduce their radar signature. Simultaneously, swarms of speedboats loaded with explosives launched kamikaze attacks. The carrier battle group’s Aegis radar system — which tracks and attempts to intercept incoming missiles — was quickly overwhelmed, and 19 U.S. ships were sunk, including the carrier, several cruisers, and five amphibious ships. “The whole thing was over in five, maybe ten minutes,” Van Riper said.

    The red team had struck a devastating blow against the blue team. The impact of the OPFOR’s ability to render a U.S. carrier battle group — the centerpiece of the U.S. Navy — militarily worthless stunned most of the MC ’02 participants. Van Riper described the mood as “an eerie silence. Like people didn’t really know what to do next.” Blue team leader Bell admitted that the OPFOR had “sunk my damn navy,” and had inflicted “an extremely high rate of attrition, and a disaster, from which we all learned a great lesson.”




    Millennium Challenge: The Real Story of a Corrupted Military Exercise and its Legacy
     
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  5. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    So ask your self this question about 1948. All Israel “won” in 1948 was survival. It lost land, some of which was part of the land regained in 1967. Why didn’t the Palestinians return to the “West Bank,” which was then part of Jordan? And why is that Israel’s fault? The fantasy that Israel’s small army displaced hundreds of thousands of Arabs while fighting a war of survival is belied by the reality. But, from 1948 until 1967, thee was no need for refugees. Unless the Arab states wanted them to be refugees
     
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  6. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    No they can’t. The US has a carrier group there
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2023
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  7. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    I recalled this morning that the US has a troop presence in Syria. And continued interests there that have to be supported. So thst is a strategic reason for our carrier presence.
     
  8. Contra

    Contra GC Hall of Fame

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  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    I know you meant carrier group. But you were right the first time. The military-industrial complex is a gargantuan jobs program.
     
  10. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

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    He has the right to free speech. No matter how despicable. As I Jew, I prefer when the anti-Jewish, pro-terrorist people speak out. I like to see the demonstrations in support of terror. Have you noticed how many of them west masks? So when they come out, we know who they are. Just know who he is and reconsider sending your smart young offspring to Columbia.
     
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  11. swampbabe

    swampbabe GC Hall of Fame

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    I would be skeptical of things tweeted by Collin Rugg. Maybe not in this particular tweet but he does have a history of tweeting nonsense, particularly after Parkland
     
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  12. gator95

    gator95 GC Hall of Fame

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    Yes he has the right to free speech, but not the right to say whatever he wants and still keep his job. If a professor said he was racist against blacks, he would be fired on the spot(rightfully so). Should be fired in this situation as well.
     
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  13. apkgator

    apkgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Do you have direct knowledge they helped plan the attack? Even if he actually does have that info, do you believe the President should show his cards at this moment? Plenty of reasons to slow the roll in regard to that particular topic
     
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  14. mutz87

    mutz87 p=.06 VIP Member

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    Quite the contrary to being a simple question of where I draw the line, you already drew it in the extreme in your question and expected me to answer it based on that extreme. Remains, that even so-called just wars where civilians died are not necessarily moral or just in any absolute, binary way as you seem to suggest.
     
  15. defensewinschampionships

    defensewinschampionships GC Hall of Fame

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  16. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    In addition to carrier based aircraft. This is a LOT of airpower

     
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  17. Contra

    Contra GC Hall of Fame

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    I did not draw the line in the question I asked. I simply asked if that is where you draw it. If you don’t draw it there, then where do you draw it? It is a simple question.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2023
  18. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    You certainly have a right to enjoy being lied to and manipulated, but you can’t expect everyone to go along with you for the ride. Hamas doesn’t exist without Iran, so the “I have 51 intelligence officers who say the Hunter laptop is Russian disinformation” routine isn’t going to fly here. Comments like these from the POTUS give Iran an off-ramp. And that is by design. Biden’s not going to come out and say “we were wrong about Iran.” But don’t insult our intelligence that somehow Iran may not have been behind this. Iran is to Hamas what oxygen is to humans. Of course, they helped plan the attack. Biden is just hoping to dupe enough people like he did with the 51 intel officers comment. House of cards, this administration.
     
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  19. dave_the_thinker

    dave_the_thinker VIP Member

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  20. apkgator

    apkgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Lol, quite the drama queen. Again, at a minimum he certainly has deniability.....and you are assuming we have gathered complete and concrete intel in a week. If we had it prior it would have been shared w Israel, so clearly there were some gaps.
    But let's be serious....please name a political or military leader that has shared all of his intel with the world, including his enemies? Cause the answer is nobody. And yes, I would MUCH prefer our President play his cards close to the vest while giving an interview on 60 minutes. He now has latitude re his future actions and that is in the best interest of this country and our allies.
    Sorry if not being fully in the loop hurts your feelings. You'll get over it.
     
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