Lost Two Legends Today

I didn’t say they would. I’m only suggesting that it’s not uncommon to change rules a generation later.

 

It's been reported that he bet on his team as a player and coach and that he had huge gambling debts. It's not a big leap that, even if he didn't bet against his team, he provided insider info to his bookie or that he would throw a game to ease his debt. No HOF for him1

 

He must have thought it was "owed" to him to get a hit at his last at bat. The goal is to get on base, but he'd rather strike out swinging at balls than to take a walk. Arrogant shit

 

Yep, loved to watch him play but the ban should stand. Interestingly, though, he was banned for life. So, technically, he is not banned in death. Still won't ever get in.

 

Ortiz is in, a Roids user.

 

My understanding was he only bet on his team to win but I could be wrong. With point spreads black and white turns grey.

 

Damn, damn, damn

 

Manfred is the worst. He makes Gary Betman (NHL comish) look good and that takes a lot.

Manfred actually allowed Stu to toss around his split city threat for the Rays. Knowing it was never going to happen.

Guy is just terrible.

As for Rose. Pre Rays, I had two teams growing up. Dodgers first, then in 10th grade we moved to Cincy of a short period of time. (My dads hometown). My dad has been a Reds fan and watched them play at Crosley Field as a kid. He was emotional when he called to tell me Pete had died.

I got to see Rose as a player/manager at Riverfront in his final season as an on field player in 1986 and he managed them the next year. We then moved back to Florida.

 

It’s sealed by his agreement and no one knows what he did.

 

What does Ortiz have to do with Matumbo

 

It doesn't , it does with Rose being in the hall though. The thread is also about Rose, right?

 

If you look at the legal definition, it certainly isn't. Using the "the other guys did it too" simply tries to deflect the guilt of their own actions.

The defendants at Nuremberg repeatedly attempted to justify their actions by saying "the Allies did it too," particularly the Soviets. The only one who got away with that was Admiral Karl Doenitz, who was supported by none other than Fleet Admiral Chester Nimitz who stated that unrestricted submarine warfare was the policy for the Americans starting December 7th, 1941. What Nimitz stated, and was supported by Doenitz, was that the rules of naval warfare was equally applied.

For Rose, he cannot justify betting on his own team because that precedent has been tried, or hasn't even been implemented, by other examples of the past, particularly the Black Sox scandal. Jackson tried to return the money and played his ass off during the World Series, and Buck Weaver was never given anything, but was banned due to "guilty knowledge." Landis was known as a federal judge who had more decisions overturned by appellate court than any other judge, but MLB took those rulings to heart.

"Regardless of the ruling of juries..."

 

Baseball and the Nazi's are not the same. My father played pro baseball, his father fought the Nazi's. As a player Rose deserves to be in the Hall. I am sure Meyer treated Percy Harvin differently than a 3 star scrub.

 

I saw him decades ago at his restaurant in West Palm Beach. He seemed to be in a foul mood or perhaps he was always like that. He made a federal deal out of having to pay addtl $$ for a hat he autographed, which we didn’t purchase. Our kids were young and had no clue who he was. It was a bizarre visit that showed he was in a bad mood or just forever bitter. RIP but I wasn’t a fan.

 

That’s nothing to do with no, no, no. You don’t watch basketball I guess.

 

I get you now, I forgot all about that, lol. For what it's worth Mutombo was a great human. Rose was just a great ball player.

 

You should’ve quit while you were behind. It’s the example you used to compare.

 

I wasn't behind. I both understand history and legal concepts. Rose broke the rules. He knew of the rules, yet broke them. Nothing else matters.

Unless the HoF changes their official policy, Pete Rose will NEVER be inducted into the HoF. Joe Jackson has yet to be inducted 74 years after his death, and he was both a greater player AND less guilty than Rose.

And I say this while worshipping Rose from the time I was 8 years old. I still have those old Topps baseball cards of Rose in those wonderful old-school Reds uniforms. Pete Rose was a childhood idol of mine, and I can say he was the face of baseball from the 60s through to his retirement.

But he broke the rules. Period. I'm an Eighties Gator. Charley Pell is my favorite Florida coach. What he did was no different than any SEC coach or Bobby Bowden, Darrell Royal, or anyone else. But it still doesn't absolve him. Charley broke the rules.

 

Okay. Those who never sin can cast the first stone.