Let's be honest about who we are.

duggers_dad · Dec 7, 2023

eastowest said: ↑

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okay

ThePlayer · Dec 7, 2023

UF24ou14 said: ↑

Other than two decades of greatness, we've pretty much always been a "Wait 'til next year" program. We were before 1990 and we are since 2009. I've been going since I was in first grade in 1961. Been thru the highs and lows. Charley Pell showed us what we could be, but, alas, we know how that turned out. SOS and Urban brought our greatest hopes home to us. But, things aren't what they used to be and probably never will be again on a consistent basis. I'll always be a Gator, no matter what. But, I no longer get the enjoyment out of it, like I no longer enjoy the NFL. I'm glad I was there for the greatness and will always hope for the best, but the losses don't ruin my life like they used to. Only been to two games since 2012 with last year against S. Carolina being the first. I loved the experience, but it isn't the same. From the end of some great traditional rivalries that I watched even without really caring who won, to the transfer portal, now the NIL, the control of virtually the entire system by ESPN, etc. I'm glad I grew up to be a Gator in a different era. Rightly or wrongly, other than my family and friends, Gators football was the most important thing in my life. Now, if they getting pounded, I don't sit and suffer thru it until the last second ticks off of the clock like I used to. Never left a game early, never turned off the TV, but now, I have other things that I can do. It does sadden me, because my family had ten seasons tickets for decades, and it was an opportunity for all of us to be together, even though most of us didn't live in Gainesville anymore, and Gators football gave us that. Prior to that, my grandpa had faculty and staff tickets in section 4. I used to see at least 40 people every game that I had known since I was a kid. Even before we gave up our seats, other than my family, I rarely saw anyone I knew. With a new era comes changes, and in my opinion the changes are ruining something that I loved, and I don't think we'll ever see again.
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We have undoubtedly had more than our share of questionable hires (1904-1965 & beyond).
If you read stories from older Gators, very few even wanted to come to Gainesville to play.
Which is funny because I really don't think Ga Tech, Bama or Ole Miss were any utopias.
The truth is we haven't had the desire nor Administration in place to make it all happen.
'Wait 'till next year' was the rallying cry from a fanbase that was exhausted from losing.

MarineG8R · Dec 7, 2023

hoyt233 said: ↑

The recent tenor of this forum is giving a new meaning of "Swamp Gas".
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Here you go.

murphree_hall · Dec 7, 2023

Mikog8tor said: ↑

UGA not that far behind us in academic rankings, so it can be done.
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They are well behind us. Nationally we are #28 and they are #47. Out of public universities, we are #6 and they are #20. That is a significant gap, and we are not in the same tiers.

paidinfull · Dec 7, 2023

BLING said: ↑

Well, that’s the reason you say “one free transfer” without having to sit. The genie was already out of the bottle (or at least they destroyed their credibility by granting waivers on the sit-out rule). But they can still crack down on a second or third transfer. Just make it so there is no exception on multiple transfers after the “free” one. No additional waivers. That seems entirely reasonable compared to kids playing at 3 or 4 (or potentially even more) schools in their career.
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Easy to say, and I’m good with it. They’re so scared of being sued, they don’t enforce anything though, so don’t get your hopes up on it actually happening.

Kids playing at 3-4 schools is not really a super common thing, and I don’t think it will be. It’s another one of those things that gets talked about a lot, but it’s not really something I’m overly concerned with. Most that move more than once are not seeing the field. I’ve seen 3 a couple of times where they used both their undergrad and grad freebie. I’m perfectly fine with making it one total move, and would prefer it be a reward for graduating, putting in your time, and honoring your commitment. I just don’t see it happening, and don’t see them tightening up on the waivers even if they do change the rule.

UF24ou14 · Dec 7, 2023

GatorLuke said: ↑

Can’t stand the give up and accept mediocrity mentality. I agree about the change in the football landscape with NIL and the ridiculous free agency portal. BUT, I won’t settle for mediocrity and neither should the fans. Georgia is no slouch in the Public University rankings at #20 & we were in the SEC championship game 3 years ago.

If you wanna accept mediocrity to help your enjoyment of being a fan, go for it. In my opinion, it’s absolutely ridiculous to say UF can’t be a consistent winner again. GA was a good program for 30+ years and it took their head coach 6 years to be great & win a Natty.

Please do not accept mediocrity Gator Nation!!!!
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From 1989-2001 uga was just a so-so program with more losing seasons than they had 10 win seasons. That's twelve meh seasons in a little over 30+ years. Mark Richt righted the ship, and even he had some less than stellar seasons, including many 4 and 5 loss years. Kirby stepped into a competitive program left to him by Richt, and with the Georgia legislature making it impossible for anyone to keep tabs on what they did at uga by passing what's called, "Kirby's Law', he's done great. Not saying he wouldn't have done well anyway, though.

duggers_dad · Dec 7, 2023

murphree_hall said: ↑

They are well behind us. Nationally we are #28 and they are #47. Out of public universities, we are #6 and they are #20. That is a significant gap, and we are not in the same tiers.
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I’d be okay with slightly stupider but better football.

GatorLuke · Dec 7, 2023

What needs to change is more ruthlessness from the coaches and program till the NIL and Portal changes. Can’t be so nice. Unfortunately I would do terrible in the structure because I like growing a relationship. Relationships during recruiting and business once they step on campus.

GATORAJE · Dec 7, 2023

HisDoc said: ↑

The University of Florida is an elite academic insitution with a world class athletic department and overall sports program. We do NOT, however, have a good football program. We are not a football school.

College football is becoming something that is hard to enjoy. The changes over the last few years have been the death knoll for team pride, loyalty, and team-first mentalities. The NIL is disgusting and out of control. The transfer portal is creating teams full of mercenaries. Almost all of us, as fans, agree about those things. And our beloved university has shown it is not willing to tread deeply in those waters. I'm not sure that is wrong. It may even be applaudable. But it does mean we won't ever have sustained football success in this environment, esp in this conference.

I think we will have pockets of success, now and then, in men's hoops and maybe even football. But we're more Stanford or UNC than Bama or Georgia - great academic schools with great athletic programs with a lot to be proud of, even if it is mostly in sports I don't enjoy or really care about.

So, as a fan, if we expect the football glory days to return or if we expect championships, we are setting ourselves up for misery. However, if we can enjoy the game for the game itself, without lofty expectations, I think that type of fandom is reasonable and profitable. Ricky's "catch" and the comeback at Carolina this year - those were great moments that I enjoyed, even in the middle of a terrible season.

A&M fans still like to root on their team. So do South Carolina and Kentucky and Mississippi State and Arkansas and even Vandy fans, even though none of those teams have sniffed even a conference championship in decades. Success, when it comes to them, is a pleasant surprise. Mediocrity is the norm.

That is who we ARE and have been for 13 years. The odds of that changing are slim. For me personally, I'll either learn to embrace that and have joy, or I'll need to find a new way to spend my precious free time. Because football greatness, especially sustained, will not happen in Gainesville. Our athletic department and University have different priorities than the ones that can do that. That is the reality. And it's probably a good thing. Expecting it, when it is unattainable, is the mistake I've made. And the fruit has been terribly frustrating as a fan.

Moving forward, I purpose to read less, cheer more, and expect little. Those midling SEC schools have it right. And I think we would all be much happier fans if we did that.

Go Gators.
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Some good and valid points in these. I realize most here will not care, but, I can tell you the fans of every D1 program outside of the P5 are saying "welcome to our world".

dabigunit · Dec 7, 2023

We are a good football school. Our idiot admin keeps hiring bad Coaches.

murphree_hall · Dec 7, 2023

duggers_dad said: ↑

I’d be okay with slightly stupider but better football.
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I think we’ll be better at football without dropping academically. Just need the old alumni (a.k.a. 2.3 GPA dummies ) who got in before the high academic standards to not mess it up with all their illogical complaining.

tegator80 · Dec 7, 2023

hoyt233 said: ↑

The recent tenor of this forum is giving a new meaning of "Swamp Gas".
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So you are saying, brain farts have something akin to REAL ones???

HisDoc · Dec 7, 2023

tegator80 said: ↑

To the OP:

Nothing wrong with your take...with a couple of questions or provisos.

First of all, there is absolutely nothing written in stone that says UF (or any other academic institution) shall be elite in anything - academics, general athletics, football. But somehow, we became quite elite in all three. That to me is quite remarkable. But now comes the questions/provisos.

The game of major college football has changed. There is no going back. Actually, the true answer is that it proclaimed to be a "dog" when it was always a "bear". Calling it one thing when it is patently something else is foolish. It is just that we wanted to believe it. So what is a "dog"? Amateur competition filled with passionate and loyal student-athletes. The "bear"? Obviously a semi-professional sport. All that has happened in the recent past is that the "formula" to success got sophisticated and Bama got it perfected. Then UGa (and Clemson) stole it and now they are brewing it just about as well. The outliers like Oklahoma, OSU and Michigan (along with other latter-day blue bloods) are trying hard to get into the game.

Now to UF. There are two distinct paths we can go. The first is to be Vanderbilt or Harvard or Yale. And I would use Harvard and Yale because Vanderbilt may hear the siren's song of the SEC money. We shall see. That is the way we are heading, IF the academic side wins. The other path is the old "if you can't beat them, join them." We ARE in the SEC. That means we have already "joined them." But is collecting revenue and spending it "wisely" the way the brain trust - and their other money - thinks? If I had to take a temperature, I would plainly say that UF is attempting to be "a bit pregnant", and you should know that is not possible. And so, we have THE question:

If/when we decide to go "all-in, but not ALL-IN", what are YOU going to do? Are you going to cheer for those guys who have been bought and paid for...for at least one season...because that is what you have always done? Really? Methinks your "nobility" is going to wane and suddenly the fall leaves and walks in the woods is going to be more compelling. But that is in the future. Say the next 3-5 years from now. And now back to the first path. You are going to put on your best "Harvard" shirt and proclaim that "losing big in football is as noble as academics"? REALLY???

I can't speak for the nouveau UF fans. But I would say that the ones who cheer the loudest and spend the most dough are passionate about being a player in the major college arena. And so, Path 2 is really the only one. Again, unless the pure academicians win. We shall see.
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I agree with the premise of your question. And that is my point. The game HAS changed. Even if someone figures out a way to reign it in a bit, there is still no going back to good 'ole (I'd argue much better) days.

I do not think our University, the UAA, nor our boosters have the same mentality as the ferocious, win at all costs, spend as much as it takes folks in Tuscaloosa, Columbus, Athen, College Station, Austin, and Baton Rouge do. That isn't who we are. I don't think we have enough "Path 2" boosters. Those fan bases/alum do. And, because of that, I don't think we can or will ever have SUSTAINED success or even be what we would consider to be a "successful program" (I would define that as regulary competing for championships).

I DO think we can have years, even consecutive ones, that we field a good, competitive team. We are in a recruiting hotbed and have a lot to offer good players. The right combination can produce plenty of wins. But that is very different, IMO, than what the average Gator fan (esp ones on message boards) expect. We expect Georgia/Bama, or at the very least LSU, level of competitiveness. That requires investments of resources that we just will not do, IMO. Can we be an Ole Miss with the right coach? Yes, I think we could be.

And to answer your direct question, I don't know. And that makes me sad. Ever since I was a freshmen in 1992 watching Shane, then Danny sling it all over the Swamp, following Gator football has been one of my greatest past times. I was at the Choak at Doak in 1994, followed by the 5th quarter in the French Quarter in Jan. I live in Texas and travel once a year with one of my kids to watch a game in the Swamp. This year I did it twice. Next year, I'm taking an Aggie buddy to the Swamp and plan to see the Gators in Austin. So the thought of being ambivalent is sad to me. But I don't think we are far away from the game being a shell of what it once was. I watch ZERO NFL games a year - no interest whatsoever. But watching one year mercenaries that aren't any more a Gator than a free agent on the Cowboys is a Cowboy fan is unpalatable. As is wondering if our best players every year are going to look for greener pastures. I'll be honest, I WISH I didn't like the game. Because it is becoming (has already become) unlikeable. But I really, really like my Gators on Saturdays.

tegator80 · Dec 7, 2023

duggers_dad said: ↑

I’d be okay with slightly stupider but better football.
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Um, the traditional version of Ga Tech? Okay. One vote for mediocrity!

duggers_dad · Dec 7, 2023

murphree_hall said: ↑

I think we’ll be better at football without dropping academically. Just need the old alumni (a.k.a. 2.3 GPA dummies ) who got in before the high academic standards to not mess it up with all their illogical complaining.
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You’re talking about my people.

tegator80 · Dec 7, 2023

GatorLuke said: ↑

What needs to change is more ruthlessness from the coaches and program till the NIL and Portal changes. Can’t be so nice. Unfortunately I would do terrible in the structure because I like growing a relationship. Relationships during recruiting and business once they step on campus.
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Unfortunately, you have to take the bad with the good. What you have described is...Bruce Pearl. Thanks but, not my cup of tea.

tegator80 · Dec 7, 2023

HisDoc said: ↑

I agree with the premise of your question. And that is my point. The game HAS changed. Even if someone figures out a way to reign it in a bit, there is still no going back to good 'ole (I'd argue much better) days.

I do not think our University, the UAA, nor our boosters have the same mentality as the ferocious, win at all costs, spend as much as it takes folks in Tuscaloosa, Columbus, Athen, College Station, Austin, and Baton Rouge do. That isn't who we are. And, because of that, I don't think we can or will ever have SUSTAINED success or even be what we would consider to be a "successful program" (I would define that as regulary competing for championships).

I DO think we can have years, even consecutive ones, that we field a good, competitive team. We are in a recruiting hotbed and have a lot to offer good players. The right combination can produce plenty of wins. But that is very different, IMO, than what the average Gator fan (esp ones on message boards) expect. We expect Georgia/Bama, or at the very least LSU, level of competitiveness. That requires investments of resources that we just will not do, IMO. Can we be an Ole Miss with the right coach? Yes, I think we could be.

And to answer your direct question, I don't know. And that makes me sad. Ever since I was a freshmen in 1992 watching Shane, then Danny sling it all over the Swamp, following Gator football has been one of my greatest past times. I was at the Choak at Doak in 1994, followed by the 5th quarter in the French Quarter in Jan. I live in Texas and travel once a year with one of my kids to watch a game in the Swamp. This year I did it twice. Next year, I'm taking an Aggie buddy to the Swamp and plan to see the Gators in Austin. So the thought of being ambivalent is sad to me. But I don't think we are far away from the game being a shell of what it once was. I watch ZERO NFL games a year - no interest whatsoever. But watching one year mercenaries that aren't any more a Gator than a free agent on the Cowboys is a Cowboy fan is unpalatable. As is wondering if our best players every year are going to look for greener pastures. I'll be honest, I WISH I didn't like the game. Because it is becoming (has already become) unlikeable. But I really, really like my Gators on Saturdays.
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Nice reply. If I may assist, your takes end badly either way. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

murphree_hall · Dec 7, 2023

duggers_dad said: ↑

You’re talking about my people.
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I wouldn’t get in by today’s standards, either.

GatorLuke · Dec 7, 2023

tegator80 said: ↑

Unfortunately, you have to take the bad with the good. What you have described is...Bruce Pearl. Thanks but, not my cup of tea.
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Players get squeezed out now to make room, even at UF. It’s a business till NIL & the portal change.

wingtee · Dec 7, 2023

murphree_hall said: ↑

They are well behind us. Nationally we are #28 and they are #47. Out of public universities, we are #6 and they are #20. That is a significant gap, and we are not in the same tiers.
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Ugh … not making me feel better. I’ll trade with Geo right now .

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