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HUGE NEWS: Judge Cannon just dismissed documents case based on unlawful appointment of Jack Smith.

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by Gatorrick22, Jul 15, 2024.

  1. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    Trump has said he didn't declassify the documents.
     
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  2. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Only two problems with those statements. First, while the president does have the authority to declassify documents it requires specific procedures. Trump never implemented the procedures to declassify the documents when he was in office. Secondly, that authority doesn't apply to former presidents. Once Trump left office he had no absolutely authority to declassify documents.
     
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  3. AzCatFan

    AzCatFan GC Hall of Fame

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    Trump never declassified the documents. Full stop here. Second, even if he did in his head, which is super silly to begin with, documents aren't declassified until they undergo a review and are appropriately marked as declassified. Trump having docs at MAR still with TS/SCI marking on them clearly show the documents needed to be treated as classified.

    Second, the Presidential Records Act clearly states that all documents pertaining a POTUS administration needs to be in the possession of the National Archives. NARA clearly did not have possession of the docs at MAR. And the PRA is what gave the Feds the authority to take the docs, even against Trump's desire.

    Third, the DOJ has had the power to appoint special councils going back to Watergate. Cannon's ruling cites zero precedent, and overturns decades of precedent. It's a bad ruling.

    Fourth, Cannon's ruling doesn't stop Garland from charging Trump without a special council. And the only reason why Garland appointed Smith was to remove any appearance of being partisan. But now that the gloves are off, and Cannon basically said Smith was too impartial, I say eff it, and charge Trump anyway.
     
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  4. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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    Again, it’s not what president Trump did; it’s what former president Trump did that got him indicted. If he had just returned the documents when asked, as happened with those other examples, surely no charges would have been brought against him. Look at the indictment, and you’ll see it’s focused on the lying and refusal to return them. I’m not a fan of political prosecution, but the facts here are very clear.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2024
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  5. ETGator1

    ETGator1 GC Hall of Fame

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    No need to argue, at the very least, Trump should have been given the "presumption of innocence" which he was denied.
     
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  6. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 GC Hall of Fame

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    He hasn't even had proper due process... it will be tossed out on appeal even if he never get sentenced.
     
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  7. ETGator1

    ETGator1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Clearly, a falsehood.
     
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  8. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

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    I think it overturns precedent all the way back to US Grant. I believe he was the first president to appoint a special prosecutor.
     
  9. ETGator1

    ETGator1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Hypocrite. Biden, Biden's ghost writer, and Hillary Clinton are laughing at your BS.
     
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  10. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    He was given the presumption of innocence. That is why they asked for the documents to be returned for several months instead of jumping straight to a raid and legal action. If he had returned the documents any of the first three times the request was made, this court case would never have been brought.
     
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  11. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Trump has the "presumption of innocence". If he is ever tried the juries will be instructed the defendant has the presumption of innocence and that it is the burden of the government to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. If the former president wants to exercise his presumption of innocence he should be demanding speedy trials rather than using every possible delaying tactic.
     
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  12. philnotfil

    philnotfil GC Hall of Fame

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    What due process was missing?
     
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  13. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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    I realize that Trump is a personal subject for most of us, but I don’t know how to move forward if you’re going to outright dismiss a claim without being willing to even check on it. If you change your mind, let me know, ET. Till then, take care my friend.
     
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  14. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 GC Hall of Fame

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    So... who is above the POTUS in declassifying documents? NO ONE IS... so why should he have to tell his UNDERLINGS, people not even allowed to declassify documents, of even look at these documents, what he is going to do?

    Does that even sound right to you? That he would have to tell someone below his authority that he's clarifying document and what those documents are? That's is azz backwards and NO PRESIDENT before Trump has had any problems just declassifying without the UNDERLINGS from the other side knowing what is in those documents.

    Inventing spying is stupid-rich...
     
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  15. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

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    Yes, he took records he 'declassified' in his mind without telling anyone else. Then he refused to return them when repeatedly asked. None of this would matter if he'd just done what everyone else has done and returned the documents.
     
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  16. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

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    Since you're apparently convinced that Trump actually declassified the documents before leaving office please provide a credible link indicating that he did so. And by the way Trump's statement that he could declassify documents with his mind is the ultimate absurdity although his low information supporters maybe including you probably believe it.
    Trump claims presidents can declassify documents "even by thinking about it" - CBS News
     
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  17. AzCatFan

    AzCatFan GC Hall of Fame

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    Trump had the presumption of innocence. He could have returned the docs, like Pence and Biden did, and nothing would have come of the case. Instead, Trump lied about having them, forced his lawyers to lie on an affidavit, and attempted to move the boxes to another residence. To claim Trump didn't have the presumption of innocence is crazy and ignores the facts.

    Just as is the claim Trump magically declassified all these docs. He didn't. Similar the claim that a past POTUS can keep any documents he wants. The PRA states the exact opposite.
     
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  18. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    I don’t know. With the events Saturday, that may slow his roll. Especially considering the case is doomed regardless. As a prosecutor, you are bound by an oath not to proceed unless you believe you have a decent shot at conviction.
     
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  19. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 GC Hall of Fame

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    Not my job...
     
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  20. Gatorrick22

    Gatorrick22 GC Hall of Fame

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    Which case is that again? Are you saying that prosecutor was NOT confirmed by the Senate too?