Daniel Penny found NOT Guilty of criminal negligent homicide.

I would not label myself an expert, as that term should be reserved for a very select few, but I spend 2-3 hours daily training and instructing on different martial arts and self defense. Applied properly it takes 6-10 seconds for someone to lose consciousness from a blood choke. In my opinion what Penny did at first was fine(not what I would have done), but from the videos I’ve seen he clearly didn’t know what he was doing…..if I had to guess I’d say he likely hasn’t trained much at all after leaving the corps and held on waaaay to long with little to no overall SA. Unfortunately through his seemingly limited understanding of what he was doing, he inadvertently killed him and should not have walked completely free. Again just my opinion

 

I didn't follow closely enough to have a strong opinion on this.

But it's typical and vile that Donald Trump and JD Trump are using it as a political football.

 

Perry was the guest of JD Vance not Trump

 

Cmon man. You can't find one post where I defend Trump but this is why I take shots from both sides here when I go full on whataboutism. Because it's true.

 

You don't think making a gesture as part of a social justice movement is different than .......inviting to a high-profile event a person who'd been charged with murder, and had become a lightning rod in silly culture wars?

 

I think Pelosi and all of her cohorts would call the cops if George Floyd set foot near her property. I find all of these elitist politicians to be intellectually insulting when they pretend to care about certain issues. I just don't see a difference here. I think there is a whole lot of nuance in these topics that purposefully get marginalized in order to play to the emotional and reactionary tendencies of people.

For example I think Penny screwed up but was trying to subdue a threat. I don't think it should be murder but it was negligent and there should be some consequences. Pitboss is mischaracterizing it here as people in support of penny feel all homeless people deserve to be killed. How is that accurate or useful? But that's where we are at. And so the right is adopting penny as a hero and emblematic of good vs evil. The truth is somewhere in between. The whole state of political theater is f$%^d!

 

I agree with this part 100%. Every word of it.

I can't speak for any other posters, but IMO adopting Penny as a hero is entirely different than making a gesture in support of..... pursuing more equal treatment of all citizens.

I've never so much as posted in this thread before what you quoted. But for the *****ng VP-elect (and POTUS-elect, really) to hold this guy up as a hero isn't just typical political theater. It's vile political theater. Designed to be nothing more than a thumb in the eye to a large group of people. Designed to do nothing more than justify spite and encourage division. It's typical from those people.

Your opinion may differ.

 

I’ve heard that too. But haven’t read any official reports. when we train once I get myself into position, I squeeze for about a second and stop even if the other guy doesn’t tap. Because once again, if applied correctly it takes less than 10 seconds with about half of that being useful. My humble opinion, I fully understand the instinct to get involved. Some of us have it, others don’t, but if you are going to apply something like a blood choke you had better know what you are doing because it can get sideways. We don’t even do it with men over 50 as there are reports the interruption of blood flow can shake loose plaque in bloodstream which can lead to catastrophic results without the person ever losing consciousness. So yes I applaud him intervening, but you gotta be aware enough to transition from that hold to a different position of control after about a 5 count.

 

Not to mention the drugs in the persons bloodstream

 

There were other people helping Penny restrain Neely, at least one of whom was African American. Bragg did not charge anyone but Penny. Also, the NYC ADA constantly referred to Penny as “the White Man” during the trial over objections from Penny’s lawyer.

 

No doubt about your comments above. My posting history would indicate I’m no fan of Bragg. I was speaking to and limiting my comments to something I’m pretty well
Versed and have committed a lot of time as a practitioner. I think penny is taller guy with longer arms so a rear naked is easier for a guy like him to initiate, but once you inject yourself into a situation you better have a reallly good plan or train enough that you don’t need that plan because you can instinctively transition from The choke into another position for control. You have to understand the self defense environment and the jurisdiction in which you are applying. Again I applaud his desire to help but with that decision comes responsibility. This is one of those where just bouncing a guys face off the floor and chipping a tooth shuts him up and gets you control with less risk to both him and you…..but striking often ‘looks bad’ to people that don’t understand the nuances involved

 

yes that is as one of many things I saw that indicated to me he had very little training not just in technique but in ability to manage the entire situation. He was actually in a very strong position, but I understand why he thinks he wasn’t.

 

I didn’t follow the trial but remember seeing Penny’s initial police interview. I think he said he was a green belt. I assumed that was in MCMAP. I do not recall him mentioning other training. If all that’s accurate, seems consistent with your intuition.

 

belt grading systems are a snapshot. Just means at some in that persons life they tested and passed that level of (insert martial art here). It doesn’t mean they continued their training even one day longer. My first love is Muay Thai and in the true traditional Muay Thai there is no belt system. Most gyms give out bands for Muay Thai skill progression but there is no ‘black belt’. Combat skills are particularly perishable skills. If you don’t train and pressure test them continually they erode quickly. He may have been a green belt at some point in his life but that doesn’t mean much when applied in the present. I’m not trying to jump the shark here and make him out the be the bad guy. I do applaud his desire to fight for others that can’t fight for themselves. Again that’s something you have or you don’t. I work with regular Joe, LE, private contractors, military, assault and sexual assault victims etc etc etc. I get it. Whether we are running a particular weapon platform or just basic self defense, when applied in a civilian setting you have a mountain of legal concerns and we address and drill them into everyone’s head. I don’t think he meant to harm that guy. He reacted without thinking….got in over his head and didn’t know how to get out of it so he did what people do under duress. They get tunnel vision, perception of time gets out of whack and they just ‘hold on’. Again just my opinion on what happened

 

No, Penny was never charged with murder. The only talk of murder was what the “victim” was threatening to do to innocent people on the subway which thanks to Penny intervening, never happened.

 

Lol, Penny was charged with second-degree manslaughter and criminally negligent homicide? Is that correct?

Big difference.

No surprise that you're shilling for scumbags at the highest level who turn this into a political football. And why do they do this? To make sure their aggrieved followers have something be angry and aggrieved about. They do this to promote division.

Vile times. Vile people. What inference should be drawn about those who support them?

 

Just WOW. The left made an issue out of someone stepping in and stopping a thug from potential violence against innocent people because the thug who was a druggie with a violent past happened to die unintentionally. The good samaritan was arrested and put through hell and public attack simply because some wanted to make a big deal out of it. Seems to me the "political football" was kicked off by the left and the left leaning media.

 

I'm pretty sure law enforcement and the judiciary pretty much just did their jobs....and let the jury decide.

Your "victim of the media" schtick is past its sell date.