Coronavirus in the United States - news and thoughts

So your objective is “owning da libs”?

 

Honestly still confused

This has nothing to do with New York. I agree covid spread wasn't just from staff, though staff was the main driver. Cuomo's big ethical problem imo was about his deceit in hiding the data than about the policy itself. He ruffled feathers with his ham handed way of enacting the nursing home policy but the policy itself was understandable given the disaster that unfolded early on in NY.

 

just my way of continuing to bash that phony, hypocritic, sexist you know what

 

Infections in US trending back up, even before Omicron. By late January / February this could get pretty ugly.

 

This kind of stuff drives me nuts:

Organ transplant patients are at risk from covid, but some donors and recipients are fighting vaccination requirements

How many of those 17 people that die each day would rather take their chances with a kidney from an unvaccinated individual?

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,WESGATORS

 

Were you against those requirements too, or just this vaccine requirement?

 

Michigan cases and deaths exploding. They just reported a daily death number higher than anything they had prior to vaccines.

70% of Michigan (age 16+) are vaccinated.
Coronavirus - COVID-19 Vaccine Dashboard
How are deaths looking to reach numbers before vaccines??

 

I'm against any requirement that guarantees death provided that the patient is willing to pay for anything close to a reasonable effort. I've personally had to make a tough decision along these lines (we rejected an option presented to us...not COVID-related), but somebody else accepted it and extended their life. If we're going to say extending someone's life a few years (or even the shot at this) by their own choice is meaningless, what then can we say of those who choose not to extend it (by not getting vaccinated)? Just a whole boatload of hypocrisy in my view.

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,WESGATORS

 

Michigan did not report a daily death number higher than anything they had prior to vaccines.

https://www.clickondetroit.com/heal...-137-deaths-average-of-5066-cases-per-day/#//

The highest single day total of deaths in the first spike was 242 on April 21, 2020 and in the second Michigan spike was 275 on December 26, 2020. So the last report was 1/2 as much as the actual highest day.

Michigan COVID: 1,447,230 Cases and 25,244 Deaths - Worldometer

It should also be noted that, due to the holiday, they had not reported since November 23, so this is cleaning up a bunch of days.

Finally, if you notice where cases are highest, you will notice that it is in the lowest vaccinated part of the state, the area north of Lansing in the central part of the state.

Michigan COVID-19 Map: Tracking the Trends

 

I'm sorry, but none of that made any sense. No requirements guarantee death. A person has a choice: they can choose to get a vaccine or not.

So since you are interested in hypocrisy, did you also oppose requirements that recipients quit smoking?

 

I was just going off NYT and what they show on google searches:



Also, where do you see a trend/map for vaccines?

According to the current map on the link you provided, its a hot mess in every county minus some northern counties that are historically republican counties.

 

Again, 17 people die every day on the waiting list. If you remove a kidney from the pool for potential transplants, it better be because there is a ridiculously low chance of that kidney helping somebody or because there is no manpower available to preserve or transplant the kidney. The choice to get vaccinated or not had already been made. And what do they do when they don't know the vaccination status or the smoker status of the donor? As long as the kidney passes the screening, you better believe it gets used.

See above.

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,WESGATORS

 

And that graph shows what I just said. See that spike in December 2020? That is the highest single day.

In your link. Scroll down.

Coronavirus - COVID-19 Vaccine Dashboard

It is worst in the areas that are in low vaccination rates.

 

These are live donors and recipients. They can choose to get the vaccine or not. This policy does not apply to donors that are already dead. With live donors and recipients, they know smoker status, so that didn't answer my question. So I will ask again: do you oppose mandates that recipients not be a smoker?

https://www.news5cleveland.com/news...equiring-transplant-patients-to-be-vaccinated

 

The bold part speaks to my point on the hypocrisy of it all. And I thought I was clear, I do *not* support a requirement for kidney donors to be vaccinated or non-smokers whether they are alive or dead. In every circumstance, you will have the ability to make an approval of that which is offered up to you (or your family to make that choice for you).

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,WESGATORS

 

Wrong, that spike is less:



Also, you are talking very small difference between counties with fewer vaccinations than those with higher rates.

Look at Isabella and OSceola county. Both are on the lower end of vaccinations but yet not as hot as a county like Van Buren that has a higher vaccine rate.

 

How about recipients? Should a recipient need to take a vaccine? How about be a non-smoker? I highly doubt that you were actively campaigning against live donor/recipient requirements before the Covid vaccine, which I would argue is hypocritical on your part.

Regardless, it is not hypocritical for a hospital to refuse to remove an organ from a live person without meeting a higher standard than removing an organ from an already dead person. The first rule of being a doctor: first, do no harm. If they think that the risk is too high to remove that organ because the donor won't abide by some basic rules associated with lowering the donor's death risk, the hospital is under no ethical obligation to endanger that patient.

 

You keep changing the picture that you are posting. But I already linked the death report. It shows that you are wrong.

And no, I am not talking about small differences. Many of those counties are well under 50% vaccination status and have much higher case counts, your carefully curated example aside.

 

Recipients are on the other end of the supply/demand equation. I have no problems with the requirements that exist for them. A recipient that refuses to get vaccinated and drops down the list will be replaced by another willing recipient who will. It's a completely different dynamic.

And I'm not "actively campaigning" about any of this, nor was I before. I would be if I had someone close to me in a desperate situation.

That wasn't the concern expressed in the article. It was concern for a decreased chance of success in the recipient. There aren't enough donors to go around to play that game.

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,WESGATORS