Coronavirus in the United States - news and thoughts

Sure. Good effort.

 

I answered him. Good try though. I get you don't like the data. That's your issue.

 

And as i've said for months. Cases themselves are useless with all the false positives(and negatives) and PCR threshold used. Best study of the vaccine is hospitalizations and deaths and the vaccine does very very well with that. Vax is just not needed for kids is my contention.

 

Exactly. They were much more aggressive with more compliance. with their rollout than we were.

 

Of coursed they waned. Nobody is arguing that. By definition any vaccine will wane with antibody protection.

Where you are wrong is the 50% in six weeks. That is nowhere in the ballpark. The efficacy went from 90+ to 80% plus in a couple of months. It may have gotten to 50% in 5-6 months in some data but I’ve seen other data that was somewhat better.

This is what happens with antibodies. This is how the body works. There are other defenses other than antibodies.

 

No, you didn't post it. You didn't post anything that backs up your claim that vaccine efficacy decreases to 50% at six weeks. So now you're just lying and saying you did.

 

At last we agree on something.

No vaccine antibody response is going to have near perfect infection protection over the long term for Covid or the flu. You could get longer with stronger doses with more side effects but that still will wane.

 

It was down to 39% with Delta before 6 months. I posted the data.

 

I did post it. You just don't like it. Tough luck.

 

I said 5-6 months, which is a lot different than 6 weeks. There is other data that show significantly better than 39% at that point. But yes vaccine protection against fast incubating infections wane, due to antibodies waning. Nobody is disputing that. It is unavoidable.

 

Those studies weren't versus delta. That's the issue. Another study showing vaccine efficacy as low as 39%.



https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2109522#figures_media

 

This was also predicted long before the trials were done (when people were speculating how effective a vaccine could potentially be). There was some doubt if a vaccine was possible at all, but I distinctly remember several virologists/vaccine experts saying it would probably be like the flu shot where it’s only 50% effective and lasts <1 year. It has to do with the nature of coronaviruses.

Pretty much all of the vaccines far surpassed the best expectations for short term efficacy. How long protection from severe outcomes lasts is more up in the air, but the apparent need for “boosters” as you get a year out is not at all surprising given the original expectation. I don’t think people envision, nor is it likely sustainable for the entire population getting shots every 6 months. But how long it’s necessary really depends on what the virus does (does it come back in another severe wave of hospitalization/death, or does it finally stay at low levels for a sustained time to prove it’s more routine as an endemic virus we deal with).

 

Here is some information on death rates from all vaccines from the past to the present... Shocking..


VAERS Summary for COVID-19 Vaccines through 10/29/2021 – VAERS Analysis

 

Yes the human body creates a much more robust immunization for the body than these new drugs. Yet we ignore the science and how the body works and are destroying peoples livelihoods.

These vaccines are leaky. We are splitting hairs on the definition. I am focused on the reality these vaccines do not do a good job of slowing the spread. The vaccinated get and spread the disease. We were never going to get to herd immunity with this disease. But now we have a massive uncontrolled trial going that may slow the development of the next generation of vaccine that is/will likely be needed. Until they get a vaccine that builds a stronger t-cell/b-cell response...we are going to struggle with covid imo. I hope I am wrong. That said natural immunity is helping. Far more than these vaccines. But getting covid is not an optimal way to fight this either.

 

I think you understand why I am calling these leaky. The vaccinated are getting and spreading this disease at a rate that would classify them as leaky. Unlike mmr and other vaccines that act in an almost perfect fashion. Then you add the reality we have no long term data...and a healthy person deciding not to take one of these vaccines actually makes a lot of sense.

 

No matter how many times the VAERS people say that their data doesn't mean what analyses like this try to show, dishonest people keep doing it.

 

N.D. Lawmaker Will Miss His Anti-Vaccine Rally After Catching COVID

A North Dakota lawmaker and an organizer of a rally Monday to oppose COVID-19 vaccine mandates is infected with the coronavirus and won’t attend the event.

Republican Rep. Jeff Hoverson posted on Facebook Sunday that he was “quarantining and each day is getting better.” The Minot lawmaker said he is taking the deworming drug ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment, and has not checked into a hospital.

 

The varicella (chickenpox) vaccine is about 97% effective through 12 months, but only about 85% effective after 24 months. And like COVID, breakthrough cases of chickenpox do happen, although those with a breakthrough case tend to have milder symptoms and heal quicker. The difference between chickenpox and COVID? Chickenpox immunity tends to last a lifetime, and most adults, including me, had chickenpox as a child. And even though the chickenpox vaccine is "leaky", cases have dropped by 90% in the US since the vaccine has been introduced.

And again, while vaccinated people with a breakthrough case can spread COVID, the vaccinated are far less likely to spread the disease than the unvaccinated. First off, the unvaccinated are 6X more likely to get COVID. So if a group of 100 vaxxed has 5 breakthrough cases, a similar group of unvaxxed will have 30. And 30 people can spread a virus much faster than 5.

Secondly, the vaccinated get rid of the virus at a much faster rate than the unvaxxed. And not all COVID cases are created equal, as we know. So, if there is one, unvaxxed case so mild the person shrugs it off as allergies or the like, that person will likely remain contagious 10 days after infection. A mild case with someone vaccinated will likely be rid of the virus completely in 5-7 days. So not only will the unvaccinated have more cases, those cases will last longer and the unvaxxed will be contagious for a longer period. And with certain people having mild cases, or being asymptomatic, this means more people who are contagious spreading the virus among the unvaxxed versus the vaccinated.

The statement that vaccinated people spread COVID at the same rate as the unvaccinated is an unmitigated lie. Yes, the vaccinated can still spread COVID, but at worst, 1/6 the rate of the unvaccinated. Plus, the vaccinated rid themselves of the virus several days faster, meaning less days of being contagious.

 

Top notch data from a source similar to a Finnebaum call-in SEC football power poll. SMH

 

So just to be clear. Essentially everything posted in post #29875 is again either an outright , and already discredited lie, a total misconception or continued intellectual dishonesty. OMG