Chinese electric cars

I haven't studied the electric cars coming from China, but if it is like any other product where they want to make a market entry, they are selling them at a loss.

It is standard China practice. Sell at a price that can't be beat to kill off domestic competition. They did/are doing the same with Solar.

 

Apparently they are selling really well abroad. Given the higher cost of Teslas and how poorly made they seem to be and their parts/design eccentricities, seems like you could do worse than some of the cars made here. I think the electric market is going to heat up in the US, and it would be cool to have options low to high end in terms of cost.

 

That's a pretty standard practice everywhere now, its basically the hole Silicon Valley ethos. Give it away, string along investors based on potential for the next capital injection, get people hooked and try to capture the market (or kill the thing you are trying to 'disrupt'), etc.

 

As a huge EV advocate, I'm against letting China flood the market with their low priced EVs for a number of reasons.

I'm a free market guy as much as I feel reality will allow and these Chinese EVs are, as enviro points out, the result of a *heavily* subisidized, centrally-planned economy's plan to globally dominate a sector. If we allow these vehicles to disrupt global markets, many automakers will fail - leading to far less free market.

Also, Chinese meddling won't stop with the grabbing of market share. EVs are data gold mines. We don't need to hand them even more.

Also, also - as so many like to point out - we can't upgrade our domestic fleet to full EV overnight. We need a more organic conversion that allows grid and storage infrastructure to mature in something close to lock step with adoption.

Also, also, also - they're crap.

 

Ok, so you need to think about this - I bought a CFMoto ATV a couple of years ago because of price and a solid 5 year history. I know going in that only one shop will work on these, the place I purchased it. If they go out of business, the next closest service center is in MS. You have to ask yourself, "is $15K that great of a price that I'm willing to leave it on fire if it ever catches on fire?" Where are you purchasing these from? As of now, very few places in the US are selling them with most purchased outside of the US. If something goes wrong, do you have a local dealer to take it in for repairs?

 

Why is China worse than Chevy or Tesla when it comes to having your data? I dont get it. Why are people so paranoid about the Chinese and not you know, the people that screw us over regularly in this country?

 

This. Either ban them or tax them out of the market. China simply can't be trusted.

 

Sure, but building software is nearly infinitely less capital intensive than setting up an EV manufacturing line.

 

Exhibit A on why capitalism / free markets will never work in the context of nation states. Exhibit B is immigration.

 

I'll take GM or even Tesla having my data over China. But you do you.

 

Agreed. We need regulation and tariffs when dealing with bad actor states.

 

If trying to gain an advantage in the market is being a bad actor, another exhibit on why capitalism is dysfunctional and beset by contradictions

 

I'm 100% against it for several reasons. I'm not against foreign trade. I'm against China wiping out the domestic auto industry in America with the help of CCP subsidization. If China is allowed to sell cars here, then I think there needs to be heavy tariffs that create a competitive market for American automakers. I'm also against allowing our greatest foreign adversary to effectively data mine transportation within our own boarders. Every Chinese company should be recognized as a front group for the CCP and PLA. So, there are spying and espionage concerns as well.

 

China doesn't engage in free trade and you seem fine with it. So why do you have a problem with the US doing the same thing to China that they are doing to us?

 

There is more to buying a car than just the vehicle. There is the service aspect which I don’t think China has here. There also is the charging infrastructure. Can the BYDs charge at Tesla chargers or is there a proprietary connector?

 

Seems to me a lot of people just dont like competition and now that Biden has gotten on board with Trump's racist China trade-war shit, almost everyone is like "paying more for stuff is good actually." Its pretty unbelievable. Obviously going back to NAFTA, free trade is a losing political issue (and I guess no one has the courage to connect higher consumer prices with our own protectionism and change the argument around this), but again, there are those capitalist contradictions again.