An honest conversation about Abortion

Just because he is causing more evil doesn't change his intent? Can't you just give him a gold star for wanting to do good?

 

While I’d generally rather avoid personal anecdotes, sometimes they are important to understand what motivates people. In our case we have a college age bipolar daughter that makes bad decisions and is in recovery from drugs. In this journey I’ve run into a lot of (mostly younger ) people who live on the margins. Often there is mental illness, addiction, or both. It is easy to say people need to be “responsible” but it is a fact that some are just not very good at doing that. In her case, and in many of these cases, bringing a pregnancy to term would be a disaster on multiple fronts. There are strong psych meds involved, illegal drugs, mental illness, genetic propensities, what have you.

Most people who are anti abortion, and more often than not typically men, have this conceptual and ideological / moral notion that abortion is wrong. More often than not it is driven by religion. It isn’t uncommon at all when people with these views are confronted with their own personal situations in this area, they easily throw away their views for the practical option of getting an abortion. Hershel Walker is probably the most notable example at the moment.

So unlike some pro-choicers, I’m not totally against a 15 week model, again, with liberal exceptions. My preference would be to keep it around viability.

There are other reasons I’d lean pro choice anyway, but the importance of the issue in my case is magnified by personal circumstances.

 

It absolutely will accomplish the goal of protecting the most innocent. I get you want to make excuses for legally allowing evil to occur. And I do hope one day you actually stand against what you acknowledge is evil.

While some will still seek to commit the act you acknowledge is evil. It will be reduced if we uphold the law.

 

All these “holier than though” right wing puppet master want-to-be’s are against abortion when someone else needs it, but by God every one of them would fly their daughter out of state with the wrong baby daddy impregnating her. Nothing they write on this thread is honest. Nothing.

This is a woman and a doctors decision. No one is aborting fetuses late term for convenience. It’s all a rouse for riling up the weak minded righties.

 

The simple answer is no. What dicussion could there be to get people to betray their interpretation of their faith? What common ground is there to convince an atheist of a purely religious based decision?

Further, this nation is so far beyond electing a moderates, we have almost ZERO moderate elected representatives.

How could one ever go about doing as you propose?

 

In that case, have you changed your opinion about "Dems" at all given the evidence you've been provided that almost all abortions performed in this country are within 15 weeks, that the majority of the remaining could be performed within 15 weeks if abortions were covered under those women's health insurance, and the remaining would be down to health of the mother or baby?

Also, since you claim to be for opening your mind, I'm linking a story I read about a woman who had an abortion at 32 weeks. Pay special attention to the information about the abortion clinic she had to use. It's one of only four in the entire country that performs late-term abortions (i.e., not exactly a thriving field), the physician who operates the clinic is now in his 80s (if he's still practicing).

The other takeaway from this story: when it does involve health of the mother or baby, just like with other healthcare decisions, it takes a lot of time and conversation for MDs to reach conclusions on diagnoses, procedure options, etc.

I found this interview hauntingly tragic, and I genuinely mean haunting. I still think about it years after first reading. It profoundly shut me down from thinking that I or anyone else should ever have any say in the decisions that any woman or her family goes through when it comes to these things.

 

If the polls are accurate, men hold the moral high ground over women on abortion. Note: women don’t get to own the issue.

 

Why in the hell are you aggressively going after this poster? He has not been snarky one time. You are not the guy I thought would do this.

 

I find your posting style refreshing. Please don’t let the libbies run you out of here.

 

I really don’t have any issue with what you’ve said above. We are probably more in agreement than not.

I think where you may have unintentionally sent things off the rails is your characterization that Democrats want to have abortions up until birth, and you’ve spent some time mischaracterizing Democrats and that starts the whole back and forth exchange. Perhaps that is what you believe - that most democrats are hunky dory violently carving up and out viable fetuses days before the due date as a matter of birth control. I’m pretty sure that’s not where most democrats are.

I will agree there are extremes on both sides that stand in the way of a solution that probably 65-75% of the population would accept. But the nut jobs capture the volume.

As a point of clarification, I think some of those who are against even outlawing later term abortions are against it because:

- Most post viability abortions, especially third trimester, are not birth control for convenience, but have to do with health issues with the mother or health issues of the fetus. Making laws against late term abortion may limit the choices of people in these unfortunate positions

- late term abortions are a comparatively small number

- Some more militant pro choicers are similar to the more militant anti gun control types. They oppose any restrictions because they view to do so is the proverbial “slippery slope”, so they’d rather have no restrictions vs risk the other side gaining ground down the road.

 

Amen! Couldn't not possibly agree more

 

There is no extreme left view… the view is it’s up to the woman and her doctor.

 

Popular Civil War trope ...

“Slavery should be left to a plantation owner and his slave trader.”

 

Due to the tribal nature of these discussions people just quickly put you in a box, so you may say 9 things that are insightful and one controversial and you get trashed.

As I said, for the minority of democrats that are for no restrictions, I can’t speak for them, but I suspect most are against it because of the issues I have outlined.

The fact that some on the right who seemed to get wrapped up around the axle with false information on late term abortions and then extrapolate pro abortion types as baby killers pretty much kills conversation.

 

A Steve Spurrier not Danny Wuerffel kind of Father…