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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. JustaGator

    JustaGator Senior

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    Says the guy who joined GatorCountry 1 month before the Russian invasion. Thanks, but no thanks Yuri.
     
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  2. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 26, 2007
    We know Ukraine is not going to sign any Trump-brokered deal. That's not the point. The US has now switched sides. We are now Russia's ally in this war. Does that not matter to you?
     
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  3. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

    Apr 26, 2007
    Trump loves Ukraine's resources that he hopes to plunder.
     
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  4. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    I like “Yuri.” And I’ve been a member of GC back when it was “Swampies.”
     
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  5. JustaGator

    JustaGator Senior

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    Two wolves with a sheep discussing what's for dinner.

    Must be sending a shiver up the back of Poland right now as the Lavrov-Rubio Pact is the obvious next step in the Trump betrayal of Ukraine.

    Trump must think since he has kids with their intelligence agents, they have something in common with us.
     
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  6. JustaGator

    JustaGator Senior

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    Oh, a deep agent. Guess your original account got banned for some reason.
     
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  7. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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    Charlotte
    Trumpsky posts this:

    IMG_0351.jpeg
     
  8. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    It will if and when it happens. Being deliberately vague here. Apologies. Better than yourself, I understand that nothing has really changed in the military pressure we are putting on Russia. In certain aspects, the aid has become less restrictive under Trump (still not permissive enough to my tastes, of course, but I’m a military man). If I had learned otherwise in the last couple of weeks, then I would be more concerned. Militarily, I know a few things that aren’t known openly. Diplomatically, my guess is as good as yours. Why Trump is saying one thing out loud while doing something different behind the scenes does not make a lot of sense, frankly. One possibility is as you say: change in policy to pro-Russia, and the military measures will follow suit at some point. Another is as I say, use honeyed words that Putin wants to hear to get Russia to the table, then show the Russia the real deal. Or it could be some possibility that neither of us has considered. We will see.
     
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  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Yes, I started trolling posters who were besmirching Urban Meyer (even his family!) with “Go Buckeyes!”

    In any case, scorn and light regard towards those who think they can addle me with insinuations that I’m Russian.

    I’ve never harbored a seething hatred for Russia even when it was the (not so) Evil Empire.

    My wife and I even hosted a Russian exchange student. And he didn’t have horns!
     
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  10. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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    Charlotte
    Hilarious.
     
  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Putin is a steely-eyed assassin of Ukrainian children and their puppies who is likely to swoon over Trump’s sweet nothings.
     
  12. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Which part? Be specific. Don’t say, “The whole thing!”
     
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  13. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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    The whole thing: Donald is strategically and publicly placating Putin to get him to the negotiating table while keeping a strong military support for Ukraine going. Hilarious.

    He hasn’t got around to understanding the details about the military support yet to make any changes. His Sec of Def was busy at the Daytona Race last week. I am astounded. There is no conclusion to draw about Trump’s plan other than he is pulling support for Zelenskyy as fast as he can so that Ukraine has to fold to Russian concessions. Putin gets what he wants. Trump can claim to be a peacemaker. Win/Win. Ukraine being screwed is just the side bonus for conservatives.
     
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  14. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    The war started on Feb 24, 2022. A day before the war started (at the Munich Security Conference) Kamala Harris said Ukraine would be joining NATO (eventually). There was never a chance of that happening. That was apparently the final straw for Putin.

    Let's remember that Ukraine was shelling Russian-speakers beginning on Feb 16 and increasing the number of shells delivered each day, in violation of the Minsk agreement that Russia signed in good faith. Recall that Angela Merkel admitted Minsk was just a ruse to buy time to re-arm Ukraine.

    As you've been told before Putin did not want to reconstitute the USSR. As many geopolitical experts like the late Stephen F. Cohen have pointed out, what Putin stated was mistranslated. The tragedy as Putin saw it was that Russian-speakers had been left behind in other countries (Ukraine for example) where they were oppressed.

    The US told Russia NATO would not expand 2 inches Eastward towards Russia. That was a lie.

    NATO planned to use Ukraine to weaken Russia and split it into as many as 32 countries. Per strategic analyst Jacques Baud, who worked for NATO.

    Your narrative is false and has been debunked by the smartest strategic thinkers on the planet (Mearsheimer, Copley, Cohen, Baud, Mercouris, Ritter). But like all the rest, you're wedded to your narrative. But facts are stubborn
     
  15. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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  16. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Previously we assumed that there was a context to the war, but helpfully, Mike Pence joins us late to inform us that history began 2/24/22. Thanks, Mike!
     
  17. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    I appreciate Pence’s post but it feels like he’s still running scared when he didn’t even tag Trump’s account.
     
  18. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Which of course doesn’t make sense as Russia likely owns most of what we’re formally Ukraine’s resources.
     
  19. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    Ukraine could have had a peace deal a month into the war. At this point the war only ends on Russia's terms. Ukraine will be demilitarized, it will not be joining NATO ever, and Russia will be taking some territory. It was always going to end this way. The US, NATO and Ukraine screwed Ukraine. Russia gave Ukraine every chance to avoid war. Your team put a lot of faith in sanctions that were doomed to fail.
     
  20. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    So if I understand you correctly, Trump has not yet pulled military support, some of the most important of which is completely within the scope of his authority (that means Congress has no oversight of it), because he does not “understand” it … but as soon as he does he will pull it. Excellent. Well, we will certainly know if you are right sooner than we will see the results of these talks, so we have that to look forward to. I forgot to ask about all of our economic measures, some of which, again, are wholly within the scope of the President’s authority. May we, likewise, expect the President to grant unilateral relief on those as well … I mean, as soon as he “understands” them, of course. I was going to also ask why Russia did not make ending some of our military and economic support to Ukraine a precondition for these talks, since they care a lot more about that than any tweets the President might send out, but I’d say you answered it: Russia doesn’t have to ask for it; Trump is going to do it for free as soon as he “understands” it. Brilliant. Your response to my post was even more hilarious than mine was.