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Chinese Technology Continues To Improve And American Tech Should Be Concerned

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by G8tas, Jan 27, 2025 at 9:10 AM.

  1. G8tas

    G8tas GC Hall of Fame

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    Late last year, we reported on a Chinese AI startup that surprised the industry with the launch of DeepSeek, an open-source AI model boasting 685 billion parameters. What made headlines wasn’t just its scale but its performance—it outpaced OpenAI and Meta’s latest models while being developed at a fraction of the cost.

    DeepSeek first caught our attention after a CNBC report revealed that its DeepSeek V3 model had outperformed Meta’s Llama 3.1, OpenAI’s GPT-4o, and Alibaba’s Qwen 2.5 on third-party benchmarks. The startup spent just $5.5 million on training DeepSeek V3—a figure that starkly contrasts with the billions typically invested by its competitors.

    Just a month after releasing DeepSeek V3, the company raised the bar further with the launch of DeepSeek-R1, a reasoning model positioned as a credible alternative to OpenAI’s o1 model. Licensed under MIT, DeepSeek-R1 allows developers to distill and commercialize its capabilities freely. This accessibility has made it an appealing choice for smaller teams and developers working on tight budgets who still need high-performing AI solutions.


    Meta AI in panic mode as free open-source DeepSeek gains traction and outperforms for far less - Tech Startups


    This model requires half the computing power at half the price. We're spending billions of dollars only to be outshined by something that costs significantly less.
     
  2. thomadm

    thomadm VIP Member

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    Wouldnt surprise me if the model was a hacked copy of ChatGPT's latest dev copy with some tweeks. Something needs to be done with IP or our economy will collapse.
     
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  3. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    Why would they hack an inferior product? Maybe the Chinese are actually good at some things, this idea that they are somehow always cheating is not helping anything.
     
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  4. thomadm

    thomadm VIP Member

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    You take an existing product, tweek it to make it a little bit better and slap your name on it. I wouldn't call it inferior, just cheaper because they didn't do the heavy lifting.
     
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  5. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    LOL. That's a hell of a 'tweak' to make it use half the power at fractions of the cost. Seems like American hubris is an abundant resource though!
     
  6. ufhomerj31

    ufhomerj31 GC Legend

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    It is open source, so the work was "free".

    It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
     
  7. thomadm

    thomadm VIP Member

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    You can do that when you didn't put up the cash for R&D and don't pay your workforce. It's not apples to apples with Chinese companies. Is AI overpriced? Maybe, but it isn't free. No way am I downloading it.
     
  8. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Just put a tariff on it. Problem solved!
     
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  9. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    black swan event crushing the market today. will the big 7 bubble burst? billions to build versus millions is a lotless chips needed, same for power demand
     
  10. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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    I remember when Biden was running things we were the leader in AI. One short week of Trumpmania and we are behind by half.
     
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  11. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    Xenophobia.
     
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  12. slocala

    slocala VIP Member

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    First, the cost estimates from China need to be take with a grain of salt. They didn’t disclose all the chips and where they got them — US export controls are woefully lacking.

    second, as others have said, it is based off open source, so could be a Llama clone.

    I am skeptical that the AI race is already matured past a technology scale (chip) MIPS capacity.
     
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  13. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    Good time to upgrade your graphics card if NVIDIA keeps tanking
     
  14. CHFG8R

    CHFG8R GC Hall of Fame

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    Doesn't really surprise given the amount of surveillance they've been doing on a population of around 1B for a couple decades. Problem for CCP will be access to the best tech, which they don't have.
     
  15. gatormonk

    gatormonk GC Hall of Fame

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  16. CHFG8R

    CHFG8R GC Hall of Fame

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    Maybe because they are. Every "breakthrough" always ends up fading away. Remember when they developed a phone chip that was just as good as the advanced ones here? Yeah, what happened to that? Faded away like all their "propaganda". Call me when this thing advances beyond the press release to real applications in real people's lives.
     
  17. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    Well you could say that about AI in general
     
  18. mrhansduck

    mrhansduck GC Hall of Fame

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    Has anybody here used it and can compare and contrast with other AI apps?
     
  19. CHFG8R

    CHFG8R GC Hall of Fame

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    I think we see real applications here. Trite, IMO, but real. Again, like all things CCP, it's always begins and ends with a press release. Any amount says this is a whole lotta nothing.
     
  20. CHFG8R

    CHFG8R GC Hall of Fame

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    Of course not. This is the CCP we're talking about. Talk and chest thumping. It's all they're good for. Oh, and creating the worst real estate bubble history of mankind. Well done there CCP! Almost as smart as instituting a one-child policy 10 years into a demographic collapse.