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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    Um, what?
     
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  2. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    In terms of any political collapse, I’ll just say that these things, when they happen, occur slowly then suddenly. The most contemporary example we have is Syria. No one was predicting that regime’s collapse in October, and by no one I mean the most well-informed members of our government with access to the best information. Then by Thanksgiving it was an inexorable landslide. I don’t agree with those who say Russia’s economic collapse (which would more or less guarantee a political collapse) is “imminent.” But I also don’t agree with those who assert that Russia can sustain its current conditions “indefinitely,” by which they mean forever. No one, even the best informed people inside Russia, can tell you to a certainty how much longer the Russian people and armed forces will tolerate their current conditions, but without a doubt the risk goes up with every passing day.

    Oh, I meant to put this in my earlier post. Let’s both be grownups and admit that “no limits” language is there for the tourists. Of course, there are limits. Russia is dead to China if Russia uses a nuke. That’s a limit. China would never consider sending an expeditionary force to help Russia as North Korea has. That’s a limit. China does not provide Russia with munitions, even though China has them in excess and Russia very badly needs them. That is a limit. Like any hard-core realist power, China makes its decisions based exclusively on fear, honor, and interest. When Russia no longer suits China’s ends, China will turn on them in a heartbeat.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2025 at 10:24 PM
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  3. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    interesting

    Putin's Military Purge 'Unnerved' Russian Elites: Report

    The arrests and firing of several high-profile associates of former Russian Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu by Kremlin authorities have sparked deep anxieties among members of the Russian elite connected to the current head of Moscow's Security Council, according to a new report.

    A slew of well-known figures working in the Russian government and the military were arrested and axed from their posts last year. Western analysts have noted that schisms within the Kremlin's upper echelons are increasingly catching international attention as the grinding war effort in Ukraine drags on.
    ...................................
    The "purge" of senior officials in the defense ministry and military-industrial complex "turned into the dismantling of the entire elite group that had developed around Shoigu over the decades," the report said.

    "The lack of clear boundaries for the new waves of arrests and the uncertainty surrounding Shoigu himself are clearly making his entire clan nervous," it added. "Shoigu himself, although he has so far been kept out of harm's way by personal guarantees from the president, is forced to watch what is happening without any possibility of protecting his inner circle or stopping the new arrests."
     
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  4. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

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    There will be some busy balconies in the coming months
     
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  5. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Haven’t you heard that history is written by the victors ?



    Fun fact: England commenced bombing German civilians six months prior to Germany bombing English civilians.
     
  6. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    I’m sure if England had just held off, cooler heads would have prevailed. :rolleyes:
     
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  7. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    What are we talking about now?
     
  8. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    China Pounces on Russia's Fire Sale of Prized Assets - Newsweek

    A Chinese firm will purchase a coal mine in Russia that was on the verge of bankruptcy.

    The move has been described as another instance of China capitalizing on Russia's economic turbulence and comes amid complications in the countries' "no limits" trading partnership that has developed during Moscow's war with Ukraine.

    Russian state news agency Interfax reported that an unnamed Chinese company would buy Inskaya Mine in the Kemerovo region that faced claims from Russia's Federal Tax Service (FTS) of over $2 million and complaints from workers of unpaid wages.

    In December, Russia reportedly sold its stakes in certain Kazakh uranium deposits to Chinese-owned companies. This week, Chinese ports refused entry to tankers carrying Russian oil that had been sanctioned by the U.S.
     
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  9. vegasfox

    vegasfox GC Hall of Fame

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    What's funny to me and a little sad is how dead-on this poster is and how few seem to get it. Reminds me of a British study that showed that military leaders who had IQ's of 30+ above the people they led had problems leading them.
     
  10. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    Russian oil industry just took a MAJOR hit due to increased sanctions. Biden is actually helping Trump in Ukraine in sharp contrast to what Trump did in Afghanistan.

     
  11. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    He implied England was the primary belligerent of both WW1 and WW2. And as evidence to back that up, England apparently hit German civilian targets 6 months prior to Germany doing the same to England. I assume he's talking about WW2 on that. Perhaps I was wrong.
     
  12. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Ah. And what was the relative timeline of Germany hitting Polish civilian targets during their own “special military operation” that started in September? Maybe they don’t count. Maybe that was the cost of Germany, like, “denazifying” them.
     
  13. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    Unlikely, as I doubt there were many Nazis in Poland at that time. Though I understand you were being flippant. Since we're harkening back to that era, Russia does know a thing or two about denazifying Ukraine, do they not? And it's hard to blame Putin's propaganda machine for boasting the denazification narrative when there were actual Nazis shelling and killing ethnic Russian and Russian speaking residents in the Donbas prior to the 2022 special military operation. Articles abound from Western sources about Kyiv's uneasy alliance with the far-right neo-Nazi groups doing the fighting in that region up until that time. Sounds to me more like a terrible miscalculation in Kyiv which Russia then exploited to gain control of a narrative.
     
  14. CaptUSMCNole

    CaptUSMCNole Premium Member

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    Why stop there? What about the Romans?!? They have been peace profiting since before Jesus Christ was born! And what have the Roman's ever done for us?
     
  15. CHFG8R

    CHFG8R GC Hall of Fame

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    England as the "bad guy" in WWII, which completely ignores that Stalin could have stopped it before it started by not agreeing to split Poland with Hitler. But, as usual, Russia did that Russia thing, and the rest is history. This is the part I like to bring up when they moan about their sacrifice in WWII. Oh, yeah, the one that was completely avoidable.
     
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  16. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Whatever that amount of money is, it will be a lot less than what it costs to build up our military for the possibility of fighting Russia and China (with the latest technology--drones, AI, computer hacking, etc.) at the same time.
     
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  17. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Evidence, Lee Harvey?
     
  18. demosthenes

    demosthenes Premium Member

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    I think it would be better for the US and the rest of its allies if Russia ineffectually maintains control of the region versus a much more competent China.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2025 at 1:40 PM
  19. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Anyone who takes over from Putin is going to have to play nice with the West if they want the West to buy Russian oil & gas, which is the first step in rebuilding Russia. China has too many economic problems of their own to rescue Russia from the hole they are in. China's biggest problem is that the west does not trust them anymore, just like Russia. Associating with Russia too openly after Russia's defeat (assuming that Ukraine can hold out long enough to see Russia collapse) would only make it that much harder for China to recover economically.
     
  20. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Incorrect. British bombing of the Ruhr Valley industries certainly killed some civilians, but they were not the target. Aerial bombing during WWII was notoriously inaccurate, with many bombs falling up to 3 miles off-target, depending on the weather and the amount of defenses present. Since most targets were maybe a quarter mile in diameter at the most, it might take dozens and dozens of bombs to actually hit the target.

    The British started targeting civilians in places like Dresden AFTER the Germans accidentally bombed London at night.