New laws pushing the cost of some Florida condos way up

kind of like the choice to have your septic system pumped or keep polluting the river..too easy..

deferred reserves along with reserve costs updated for inflation has siphoned money out of those units since the day the law was passed

eliminating septic tank inspections is another "self regulating" thing along with agricultural best management practices self compliance for nutrient removal systems needs to go the way of the unfunded reserves. not a big fan of regulation but the public interest needs to be protected and we have proven that we are incapable of self regulating these types of things that can create external impact.

 

some will be demolished, some will be rehabbed, a few will be saved by having done maintenance or already having reserves funded..it is definitely going to change things, much like Ian did to Ft Myers Beach, not just as dramatic and with loss of mature vegetation. prices are going up, luxury lifestyle will be in. it will take 3 - 5 years to start showing up and 10 - 15 to mature but it is about to change many parts of the costs that were developed prior to the 90's

 

We're actually talking about two different assessments here. There is the normal monthly assessment where things like painting, roofing, pool maintenance, common areas electricity and the like are paid from. That assessment was the one frequently only partially funded, but no longer under Florida law. The condo collapse spawned a whole second assessment, an engineering one for building structural safety and the like. I believe it is that second engineering study assessment that is resulting in those huge numbers we are seeing.

 

Nice dream.

In the real world buildable sites with older structures razed to the ground will be built up with larger condos and more sprawling amenities, and whose new residents are even bigger assholes about public beach access.

I’m ok with the first part of that, but the latter is the unfortunate reality of big $$$ developers and their clientele coming in. It’s up to govts to push back against that shit and maintain beach access/parking.

 

Doesn't really matter as far as prices. The great reset is 5-10 years away, housing will become a luxury for most, at least how we are used to housing.

Everything in Florida is luxury at this point. Condos were always snowbirds and retirees. Probably the worst place for them to be anyway with hurricanes and storm surge. Florida is no longer a retiree state unless your upper class or upper-middle class and the population boom has been mostly inland the last 20 years. I suspect that trend will continue.

 

Not if the govt doesn't bail out the insurance industry. No one in their right mind would build anything on the coast that expensive if they didn't have the backing of insurance. Anything 1 mile in from the coast should be uninsurable. You would suddenly have your coasts back and we wouldnt see destruction everytime a major hurricane hits.

 

While I feel bad for those caught in the middle, the era of “retire to the beach at everyone else’s expense” needs to end, this is just a good first step in slowing the pace. This should have been done years ago.
But in the more immediate climate picture, it’s people with decent money who buy these places, and everyone else who picks up the bill when these storms hit, either through artificially low flood insurance rates that we have to cover excess costs on, copooled insurance driving up rates, or straight up disaster money in the 10’s of billions that flow in after every storm. Local city and county taxes also disproportionately go to their needs because of all the things that come with living close to the beach. Streets are more likely to get flooded, wind damage is more likely, salt corrosion more likely, and in this storm with now condos and apts where dunes could be, much of Tampa ended up in sand, etc.
At some point the subsidizing needs to stop because much of the damage is preventable if we lived by nature’s rules. If these events are going to be more common some tough decisions need to be made.
Jmo.

 

New structures even right at landfall dont get “destroyed” every time a hurricane hits, modern highrises maybe only get the bottom level of their garages flooded and maybe the amenities/lobbies depending on how high they built those up.

What gets wiped out is older homes built to older codes, or trailer parks. The media always goes to trailer parks for their FL hurricane destruction scenes.

Of course all bets are off if we ever see a 185mph+ ‘cane make landfall, or if we see more storms like Milton with tornadoes that may have briefly hit 200mph. And remember, tornados can hit inland too. Some of Milton’s worst pockets were from tornadoes all the way on the opposite side of the state from landfall!

Not sure to what extent the govt is bailing out beachfront condos. Doesn’t federal flood insurance max out at $250k + $100k per dwelling? That doesn’t seem like it goes very far for oceanfront properties or luxury highrises.

 

The inevitable result of assinine development and corrupt politicians grabbing the green. Being from Ft Walton Beach I never understood how developer after developer could build south of 98, literally on the Gulf. But boy they sure did. From Pensacola to Panama City and beyond. Look at Destin, yes it's beautiful by the bay bridge, but christ ole mighty, you have houses and devlopments on sand bars.

I did learn something about how 'developers" could manipulate county commissioners when I was in the game: "Mr. Walton County commissioner", we just need you to "sign off" on this hear development plat map, and get it approved, if you do so, I red tagged the lots you and Wilma Jean can choose from, pick ya one out, for the discount price of ........ well, signin off.......

 

It’s like they don’t know what “barrier islands” are. The name is a clue they are things that largely shouldn’t have been built on.

According to the old Google machine, there are 1.4 million in the U.S. living on barrier islands and approximately half are in Floriduh.

 

I see older homes built in the 1920s do just fine in hurricanes. My great-grandparents house is still standing and it made it through the 1935 Labor day hurricane.

New high rises are damaged beyond what is visible. Salt water is what takes them out, and they are placed on the beach, which isnt exactly a good idea in Florida. High rises in general are not a good idea anywhere in Florida, especially in S Florida. Every single one will need to be demo'd in the next 30-100 years, depending on their age. The high rises in Miami are already compressing the limestone underneath and the city itself is sinking.

And the costs are not just replacement costs. Its Emergency services, infrastructure, insurance tax reforms, etc. All because grandpa wants to sip his folgers while looking at the ocean...

 

It’s going to be painful in the short term, but hopefully more sustainable in the long run. Frankly, HOAs need to be better policed. In smaller communities, HOAs attract well meaning residents. But some of these large communities, especially 55+, are a full of corruption and plain embezzlement.

 

The Thomas Edison estate took a direct hit from Ian with minimal damage and didn’t get flooded either. Haven’t heard if it took any water from Helene/Milton. I wasn’t thinking of 1920’s vintage homes. If any of those are left standing in FL they probably had “good bones” or are maybe on a historical homes list to be preserved. On the other hand there are areas sprawling with homes built in the 1950’s-1980’s. That’s that I was thinking of. These don’t do so well. In areas where the land underneath is actually valuable, it’s not uncommon to see people buy these homes just to tear them down even without Hurricane damage.

I’ve heard the idea that Miami is sinking and very susceptible to sea level rise, not sure I’ve seen it claimed the buildings are causing that. But yes, it’s definitely stupid to continue developing areas expected to be underwater within decades.

 

I live in a small 8 unit building and the law doesn't apply to us. It's for buildings 3 stories or higher. We apply monies to our reserves but they are not fully funded. we as a group agreed to pay for repairs/replace as we go for big projects like the roof. We use our reserves to cover small projects like fence repairs etc.

 

If the bank actuaries really believed that Miami was sinking and there would be significant sea level rise in the next couple of decades, they would never fund any on the water projects.

 

lots of places weren't even funding for roofs, ac replacement, repainting, etc...

 

If I remember correctly the new Florida law requires a reserve study and fully funded reserves as of a specific date?

Fully funded can be done two ways. Straight up reserves for each item specific, or pooled reserves that allow them to be used for any items. When you elect to pool reserves you lower them by about 30%. Most associations pool reserves.

Both ways are considered fully funded.

 

What do the financiers care if it floods 20 years down the road? They only care about their interest up to the point a new build project gets to closing and turned over to the HOA/condo association. After that, they’ve got their cut and it’s someone else’s problem. The banks aren’t liable for any issues. The developer would potentially be if they still exist, but most projects are shielded by being set up as individual LLC or JV’s so even that isn’t a likely recourse unless criminal acts were involved on the part of the developer.

For those Miami high rises in particular, the question is do the Russian/Chinese/Saudi/Venezuelan buyers know or care about long term risks.

 

The banks don't care because they know the insurance market or the Fed would cover their 6. They take the $ now. Only way it changes is if the govt or insurance market changes.