The 12 man on the field penalty ... What really happened.

So, the refs left us with 17 seconds out of an injury timeout? Or we frittered away the play clock down to 17 seconds?

 

I thought we lined up with 12 men? If an injured player was running off and couldn't get off in time, then I agree it's not on Billy.
Burning a TO too early IS- but that particular play is not.

Are you sure we didn't line up with 12? If we did not, then I am with you about removing this from the incompetence stack. AS you put it.

 

Weirdest torn ACL I have ever seen, there was no contact and no planting of the foot, no noticeable source of stress to the knee. He looked to be literally skipping sideways. I almost think that he had to have torn it most of way earlier and it just gave way right there.

This made me think of an anecdote from my childhood days in Chazy, N.Y.:
At this private summer camp we used to play on this giant tree swing that allowed you to run down a hill and hop on the swing to go out over the lake. We introduced a picnic table at the top of the hill from where you could launch instead of just running down that hill. This gave you more momentum to go out even higher over the shallow waters of the lake (~ 3-4 feet would be my guess. depending on water levels and waves. This was Lake Champlain, a very large lake capable of producing very large waves on occasion). Before reaching the lake there was drop of about 4 feet off to a sand and rocky beach. We would ride that swing with 2 and even 3 people on it. One early morning in the late summer one the parents just let swing go out over the lake with no rider on it. The metal cable gave way as the swing passed the shoreline and dropped harmlessly into the lake. I'm sure if that person had just sat on the swing it would have immediately given out. Instead the metal rope failed with just the slightest of forces acting on it: the weight of it's own mass and a wooden seat.

 

This is entirely inaccurate and Shane is full of it if he painted it that way. Edit: Napier specifically stated George #70 was replaced on the FG unit. #70 is on the field and in no way is injured, watch the game he is standing watching Mertz get up from 3rd down sack. He is then in for the FG as well as the OL that was supposed to be his substitute. Correction to italicized. It was GNFP that said George ran on late, they were at the game. Replay was going on broadcast so don't know for certain, but there were definitely 12 lined up for the snap. /Edit

Even with the above there is so much context missing so lets go through this entire drive of coaching ineptitude.

Denson with a beautiful pick and return to put us in business.
1&10 at 11 with 1:11. False start on Waites.
1&15 at 16 with 1:11. Incomplete pass
2&15 at 16 with 1:08. Timeout to avoid delay of game LAST TIMEOUT. UT then also takes a timeout.
2&15 at 16 with 1:08. 1 yard tunnel screen to Wilson. 2 timeouts got us a 1 yard gain.
3&14 at 15 with 0:28. We used up the entire effing playclock after that 1 yard gain knowing we have no timouts left. Mertz already on the geound with 25 seconds on the clock, not 17.

Complete incompetence to a negligent degree by BN and the entire offensive and ST staff.

 

No. 12 were lined up, this account of what happened is completely wrong as can be easily verified by watching the video evidence.

 

Using our last timeout... After an incompletion was what killed us.

 

But Billy 100% said it was an injury situation during his post game presser and when asked he refused to say which player.

 

My error then I thought I had heard it was George. Maybe that was an assumption made based on personnel on other FG.

Edit: The George thing came from the eye witness account of GNFP whom were at the game and said George ran out late. I don't think that makes sense either, so who knows.

 

Maybe you should listen to Shane's podcast before casting aspersions about him being full of it.

 

I have in the past, didn't watch this one in particular. If the posted account of what he said is wrong then I retract my statement about Shane being full of it. I still maintain what was stated in the OP was incorrect.

 

I saw a pic where they showed the 12 players lined up so Shane is wrong

 

Let’s make sure to beat this to death right on up to next Saturday — because we’re all not sure if we want Billy fired, right? Come on boys, give it up. Everybody wants Billy fired and there’s a 99% chance of that happening. Turn the page.

 

I think Shane just misunderstood coach. Coach called it an "injury issue" and that the injured player did not come off. But he actually didn't try to get off. Shane probably thought thats what coach meant.

But....Definitely 12 guys:

 

From what I understand, there was an injured player who knew the time was running, and could not get off. They instead lined up for FG and we ran on the 11 man. So we ended up with 12 guys.

The real issue is Mertz taking the sack. Need to get rid of it, even with intentional grounding we could still get the FG unit lined up cause the clock would be stopped for a moment.

The "17 seconds" is Shane saying that with a running clock, you need at least 17 seconds to be able to get a FG kicked. We had enough time, just had the flub with the injury/12 man deal.

 

Mertz was often a beat late in throwing the intermediate to long pass. In this case, he needed to be throwing the second his back foot hit the ground. The rusher probably still would have disrupted him by grabbing that foot, but at least then it is likely just an incomplete pass into the dirt or maybe he gets it off in time with a hero throw (I think the post may have been there too.)

I honestly thought BN meant someone had been replaced on the FG unit from an earlier injury in the half, but they ran on anyway. I didn't realize someone got hurt on that play.

 

Did the OL hold up any better with 12 on the play?

 

Since there was some disagreement I watched that section of the game again. Yes, Mertz took the sack that led to the scramble for the FG, but UT shifts right at the end to put 7 guys directly on the line and Mertz is taken down from behind and clobbered from the front just 2 seconds after the ball is snapped. The blitzing linebacker who gets him from behind isn't touched. Graham really had no chance.

And if someone was supposed to come off, it's not evident from the broadcast. Some lineman jog off with Mertz while others come on. It's very clear, like in that picture, we wind up with 10 guys on the line with the holder and kicker behind. That's why the exact call the ref made was "Illegal substitution, the offense had 12 players in the formation."

The real issue was all the time spent before that third down. We looked confused that entire series. I get wanting to use up the time to ensure UT never gets the ball back, but once you call that last time out you have to be that much more careful with the time left so you don't waste the opportunity.