@swampbabe wasn't a good teacher. She was a great one. It's readily apparent from her posting history, including episodes about classes and specific students. But of course you are correct; being a teacher, even for a long time, doesn't make one a good educator. Being a great educator calls for self-reflection, empathy, and expertise.
Tell that to the folks who can't afford the school they prefer. That could be due to tuition, transportation, or any of a number of factors.
The state needs to adapt. The alternative is Uncle Sam saying to the vast majority of the American people “you’re going to eat the public school system and you’re going to like it.”
That’s exactly the mentality of every hard daddy government liberal who adamantly opposes school vouchers.
My tax dollars shouldn't go to paying for rich kids to go to private schools. They definitely shouldn't be going to religious schools or home-schoolers. If a parent wants that for their child, great. They can pay for it.
Yeah, except that the fed doesn't make the decisions about education in the U.S. Maybe you should step aside from this debate if you're missing the basic understandings.
The public school system has been a godsend for this country. The whole idea is that EVERY kid gets access to knowledge. And that it isn’t state propaganda in disguise. You can cherry-pick fails, and there will obviously be some. That’s what will happen when you give 100M kids access. The vast majority of schools and teachers are breaking their backs to do the right thing. I did a week of unpaid AP training last week. 30 teachers in a room for five days asking nothing except “how can I be better.” Not a word of politics, religion, shooting beer cans, boycotting Chic-fil-A, nothing. All how can I individually get kids to absorb meaningful information that matters in real life. I am a teacher, and a career switcher. Abandoned the corporate world for multiple reasons, but the biggest one was Mission. My corporate life was essentially thwarting good intentions of employees to satisfy the requirements of never-enough profit. Last year: great! But how to get more? Five year records, great: but how to get more? This employee has been stellar for a decade, this year my 40 column spreadsheet had a couple of downs. Uh-oh, drain on the bottom line. In a school, I get everybody. Your little superstar, and that other person’s menace to society. But one doesn’t get more than the other. My hope is that MTS sees a reason to change. This may literally be the only structure and leadership he gets in his life. Sometimes it’s his only food. I assure you I won’t allow the MTS to ruin your superstar. The unspoken secret here is that this is the biggest part of being a teacher: classroom management. I had to take a class literally called that to become a teacher. HA! How quaint, that class. It was essentially how to handle one-offs in an otherwise self-perpetuating system. And that is total poo of the horse. When you open up ALL to opportunity, then you will also get ALL possibilities. It is the entire idea of public education. And I am not one, but you better have some badasses to deal with ALL possibilities. But most are, or at least trying their asses off. And I don’t know swampbabe anymore than these boards, but I would be willing to bet all my #teacherriches that she stewarded thousands of kids into outstanding citizens.
I mean, that's all well and good. But some people (who are usually quite well off) just want a tax rebate to send their kids to the private schools they probably would send their kids to without a tax refund. And there's no other way to slice it. (at least how it all currently exists.)
From my experience, this is the #1 question separating excellent teachers from the rest. Those who are willing to ask themselves and others how to get better actually will. Also, the extent of training teachers endeavor to/enjoy/endure is lost on most folks. The fortunate teachers will benefit from great PD days, whether during the school year, or the interim. Your AP training, by any professional standard, should be paid. How many of those on here bitching and complaining about schools take on additional training on their own dime? Student teachers (i.e. interns) should be paid too. Teaching is among the only professions wherein the workers pay for required internship & in-service development.
I don’t disagree jo. In a vacuum I would also favor “choice.” I fully understand the idea. In practice, it is silly. And the attack on the idea of public education is asinine. OBVIOUSLY every kid having access is not just noble, it is a strength.
No. They'd otherwise be going to the benefit of all children at public schools. The rich kids wouldn't be attending public schools either way.
The “recipients of vouchers” which you oversimplify as “rich kids” would most certainly not be attending private school no matter what. If the only people receiving vouchers would go to private school anyways, then vouchers would not be threatening public schools.
1. I didn't say all voucher recipients are rich kids. I said my tax dollars shouldn't go to paying for rich kids to attend private schools or for kids to be homeschooled or attend religious schools. 2. You don't seem to understand how vouchers work. Let's say that you have 500,000 kids. 450,000 attend public schools. 50,000 attend private schools or homeschool. You pass a voucher law giving $8,000 to every child who doesn't attend public school (with that money coming out of the preexisting education budget, rather than funding collected by a new tax). 100,000 kids request vouchers and get them. 50,000 of the 100,000 are children who didn't attend public schools the year prior. That's $400,000,000 leaving the public school system for kids who weren't going to be in it either way. You don't think losing that $400,000,000 harms public schools? And that's not even factoring in the other children who left. Here's a fact from 2023: Vouchers benefit existing private school students most Almost 70% of Florida children awarded new vouchers this academic year did not attend public schools last year, according to the state’s main scholarship funding organization. Iowa’s newly expanded program saw about 60% of students come from private education programs.
If public schools had a majority of teachers with your passion and mission…we wouldn’t be having this debate. Problem is…reality. Most teachers do not teach AP, honors dual enrollment classes. No offense but these students are likely on the right path for success and are likely not the MTS students. The rest of the student population will have challenges…putting it politely. Teachers in the public just aren’t equipped to manage these little darlings. Bottom line: vouchers give ALL parents the opportunity to move their child away from the schools where the administration has likely lost their way trying to appease the masses. The masses are becoming more and more liberal and secular. It’s the way the wind is blowing lately and therefore people should not have to subject their children to the madness. Desantis got this one right.
So you’d be fine with vouchers, as long as they only went to people who would otherwise go to public school? That’s the only way this line of argument works. Because it’s not an argument against vouchers. It’s an argument against vouchers for people who “apparently” don’t need them. And frankly, that’s a middle ground that’s reasonable. The problem with it is you’d be penalizing anyone who sacrificed a ton sending their kids to private school despite barely being able to afford it. But again, you can’t make everyone happy. Can’t let perfect get in the way of better.
