Bodycam Footage of Florida Deputy Shooting Air Force Airman Released

I really struggle with this line of thinking. If you feel threatened, why would you open the door? Especially holding a gun by your waist? You are not only escalating, but you are giving the bad actor time to shoot you first.

And robbers don’t knock on the door.

 

Robbers do knock on doors but most don’t. And most don’t come to do a crime unless they think you are away. There is no robber protocol.

 

No, they are not and that is not the law. For this shooting to be legal, the officer had to reasonably fear that he was in IMMINENT danger of being shot. Under your thought process, a police officer could legally shoot anyone he came across who was armed. They can't do that. This airman wasn't even a suspect, he hadn't broken any laws.

 

Yes, they do.

 

That makes a lot more sense to me than opening the door.

 

Maybe not to the residents across the hallway.

 

Why didn't the officer identify himself on the initial hard knock? He bangs aggressively on the door then scoots way off to the right outside of the view of the peephole. It is only after the Airman didn't open the door that he goes back. It is very possible that the Airman could have opened the door with his firearm before the officer came back for the second knock when announced himself... and then what? He probably still would have gotten killed.

If you follow my logical sequencing it just makes sense. By the time the officer announced himself, the Airman had already retrieved his firearm (because of the initially aggressive no-identification knock). He was clearly already in front of the door with the weapon when the police officer identified himself. I'd have to imagine he had a moment where he said to himself, "Oh, ok... it's the police so I'll just open the door."

As a ServiceMember, we tend to see Law Enforcement and other first responders as "on the same team", but they are just in a different fight. I could totally see the Airman relaxing a little bit too much thinking, the police are there to assist and understand/respect the 2A laws and will not shoot me. I'm speculating, but he probably assumed whatever misunderstanding there was would be cleared up quickly... colleague to colleague. A grave miscalculation.

 

Yeah, that nuance doesnt exist in practice, sorry. Prosecutors and juries give huge deference to cops on "imminent danger" and for all intents and purposes they can legally shoot anyone who is armed that just moves wrong in the cops view. That's basically enough to be "imminent danger." I think we all know what the outcome will be here, and it wont be the officer being held legally responsible for this guy's death.

 

I completely understand why the officer didn't stand in front of the door, but also, it likely led to some fear of threat by the Airman after the hard knock. As far as hiding the firearm behind your back, I could totally see that officer shooting him anyway because he would think that he was hiding a weapon behind his back. What if the officer said show me your hands? The speed at which he shot the guy does not give me any confidence that he would have allowed any hesitation or explanation.

 

Not according to the NY Times reporting.:

"When the deputy arrives at Apartment 1401, the footage shows, he first knocks without identifying himself. He then knocks again, says, “Sheriff’s office, open the door,” and steps away from the door.

Seconds later, the deputy shifts to the other side of the door, knocks and announces himself again, the footage shows."

Sheriff Releases Body Camera Footage in Police Killing of Airman in His Home

 

Who was this in response to?

 

Someone you have blocked or blocked you it would seem

 

This makes me think of the couple that broke into my home during the day while I and my wife were at work. As I have said before on other post my home is in a rural area but is very visible from the main road. These people broke into homes during the day. He would knock on the door and if it was not answered he broke the door down and went in anyway. Two different homes where someone happened to be home he ended up killing the people in the home. I assume he thought the home was empty but who really knows maybe they answered the door and he forced his way in. I would have hoped that if I had been home I would have had a firearm near by because if not I might have been killed.

Judge sentences 'pillowcase bandit' to 50 years for roles in Dunnellon man's murder, burglaries

 

You are simply incorrect. When I was a felony chief at the Hillsborough State Attorney's Office I was periodically on call and responded to police shootings. For what's in worth, I recommended every one of them be cleared and that recommendation was followed every time. This one is waay different. With respect, you do not understand the law. The "imminence" element is not a nuance, it is frequently the critical differentiating factor between lawful and illegal shootings. I suspect you "huge deference" comments comes from your gut feelings and not ACTUAL experience.

 

You literally said you recommended every police shooting be cleared lol. My takeaway from that is that the cops can basically shoot whoever they want. Is your prediction that someone goes to prison here?

 

I’m not defending the officer here. I agree your scenario is the most plausible. I think he knew it was the police which is why he opened the door. I think he either forgot he was holding a gun, and/or miscalculated how much on edge the officer was.

As usual in this situations, you have officers that maybe don’t have the temperament for the job, and/or are trained poorly. But the victim is likely alive if he doesn’t have a gun in his hand when opening the door. I still stand by my statement that no situation benefits from opening the door holding a gun.

 

Every one I responded to when I was on call, yes. Not sure why you would find that funny, my office took those shootings very seriously. One in particular resulted in some significant racial tensions in that part of the city for a few days. I was even sent to the autopsy to refute allegations the person had been held down and executed.

I spent more than one Christmas or other holiday early morning hours in a bar parking lot with a dead body, the police and a bunch of drunks. Don't ever remember LOLing about anything.

 

There’s a rail on the other side of the door. There was nowhere to hide from a peephole.

 

It is kind of funny to me that you would say cops cant just shoot anyone in the same post where you said you cleared 100% of the police shootings you could have prosecuted, especially after I just said prosecutors and juries give massive deference to cops. You couldnt have made my point any better for me. Maybe I should have thanked you instead of finding it funny.

 

You are both right. In theory cops can’t shoot anybody. But I’ve seen much worse videos than this one where cops were exonerated. The fact that the victim was holding a gun pretty much guarantees the cop will get off. They might, and should get fired, but they are not getting a guilty verdict. I doubt they even get charged.