Sweden officially joins NATO

NATO could be even bigger though, still gotta question his commitment to it

 

Even at the time humanity had come closest to extinction - the Cuban Missile Crisis - the U.S. and Russia were talking back and forth.

Now that Russia has over ten times as many nukes - and probably more deployable nukes than the U.S. has - the Democrats think it’s a good idea to shut off communication and escalate.

 

Ted Knight = funny!

 

Cannot confirm, but have read that Finland, having *officially* joined NATO (it has long been NATO-operable), is having serious problems recruiting Finns to fight Russia.

And who can blame them ? They’re not separated from Russia by benign neighbors and two oceans like we are.

 

I don't think that the Democrats are averse to talking with Russia; they are however averse to the solution of appeasement/capitulation apparently advocated by the former president and let's not forget that during the Cuban Missile Crisis the US imposed a naval blockade and with at least one US Naval warship actually intercepting a Soviet ship with missile components heading to Cuba (see photo below), a far more belligerent act than anything suggested by the Democrats with respect to Russia today.

 

Was that recently?

 

Finland has universal military conscription, a policy in effect long before it joined NATO. Going back to Stalin's invasion in 1939 the country has had a well-founded fear of the Soviet Union/Russia.
Conscription in Finland - Wikipedia

 

That's all a matter of perspective I suppose, do subs built in the 80s and 90s count as recently either? Certainly more recent than the Vasa. Anyways, I was just trying to be funny.

 

I was asking seriously. I didn't know if they had a recent failure (like in the last 30 or 40 years). I knew about the Vasa, not because I am particularly educated, but because I went to the museum a few years ago.

 

Yeah, I've been to the museum too. From what I remember they overloaded it with guns and it was built top heavy. Sank right outside of Stockholm on its native voyage after it barely traveled a kilometer in front of all the people and dignitaries that came to watch.

 

Funny haha or funny strange?

 

But for an even-keeled Russian submarine commander …

Untold story of the Cuban Missile Crisis: while the U.S. was apoplectic about nukes close to its shores, it had nukes spitting distance from the Soviet border.

 

We did have nukes in Turkey which were planning on withdrawing prior to the missile crisis. Those missiles were considered obsolete and unnecessary even back then.

 

And ended up replacing them with new ones. Truly, the US behaved then as it does now.

Then - “It’s okay that we had nukes in your backyard. But I’ll be damned if we’re going to let you place them in ours!”

Now - “It’s okay that we moved NATO 24 countries east. But I’ll be damned if we’re going to stand for you moving four oblasts west!”

 

first of all it isn’t my original thought. It’s been pretty well documented just google it. EU at 60 - the longest period of peace in Europe in over 2,000 years - one article just for example.

there are lots more. They refer to it as the long peace. And you keep bringing up countries who aren’t a part of nato… no nato member has ever been formally attacked by anyone but terrorists.

 

Pretty convenient measure of peace, because many of those members were involved in armed conflicts during that time. So the argument is that NATO members havent fought each other? Or simply exported violence elsewhere, whether it was non-NATO Europe or the rest of the world? As I said above, maybe everyone should be in NATO, we could simply end war. It cant be a very exclusive club, considering Orban and Erdogan are in it.

 

I mean trump is in NATO and I think he’s hot human garbage. I haven’t made any arguments that NATO is inherently morally good. It just has been one of key contributing factors that have prevented large scale war in Europe between major powers. There are other factors we haven’t discussed here. It’s not the only one. Idk why you keep pressing on this. Has NATO led to world peace? Lulz no. But it has added stability to the major powers in Europe. Which is unquestionably good for the western world. You could make a case that it’s not great for everyone everywhere I guess but consider that major wars between European powers have historically spilled outside of Europe. So it’s a pretty simple premise that stability and lack of war between European powers is better for most of the world.

and yes, they don’t attack each other and other countries don’t attack them.

 

I had forgotten Georgia. That’s arguably another proxy war we’ve lost to Russia. I thought it was two. But I suppose it’s three.

 

My daddy was kind of wishy-washy about Sweden. He thought that country was swell after Ingemar Johansson knocked out Floyd Patterson. Then, when Patterson annihilated the Great White Hope in a rematch, my daddy said, "I'm disgusted with all Swedes."