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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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  2. ursidman

    ursidman VIP Member

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    Putin upset over sinking of the Novocherkassk - orders failed defenders of the port to the western front.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2023
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  3. danmanne65

    danmanne65 GC Hall of Fame

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    So a submersible landing vehicle. How cool.
     
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  4. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    I have no idea what your intent is in spreading this conspiratorial nonsense, but your thesis does not make a great deal of sense. In no particular order, those F16s are gone from the inventory the moment we gave them to Ukraine (or whatever third country is donating them), not from the moment they are lost in combat. If they don’t fare well in combat over there, we are very likely not going to send any more at all as opposed to increasing the number we send. F22s do not replace F16s at all; they replace the air superiority variant of the F15. While some F16 squadrons are to be replaced with F35s, those squadrons had already been earmarked well before this war and that isn’t going to change. If anything, the upgrade of some F16 squadrons to F35s has resulted in surplus Vipers that can get some continued utility in Ukraine. Most donated F16s will simply be replaced with newer F16s. The F35 has some key advantages over the F16, but the F16 has some important advantages over the F35, too (no, I won’t be any more specific than that). That’s why not all of the squadrons are going to be upgraded. The capabilities of one plane complement those of the other.

    If the war in Ukraine accelerates an upgrades program already in progress, then so much the better. We probably won’t need the advanced fighters for Russia. First, because the Russian IADS and Air Force has proven itself a paper tiger. Second, because Russia, despite all of its bluster, is clearly afraid of us and will probably not cross the line that would bring us in. But we will need those advanced fighters if China makes its move on Taiwan and if the President decides to intervene.
     
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  5. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    While I take the author’s point that the F16 may change the existing balance of power in the air domain in Ukraine’s favor, I’m not sure Russian “air superiority” is about to end … since it never existed.
     
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  6. 92gator

    92gator GC Hall of Fame

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    No conspiracy. Common sense.

    Is the F-16s kick ass in combat, it will beg the question: why did we spend hundreds of billions of dollars on newer craft [like] the 22 and 35? Conversely, if they face plant in Ukraine, it will serve as justification --or motivation for--investing in newer /replacement air craft, which will mean hundreds of billions of dollars in orders for MIC companies--as opposed to maintaining the fleet of 16's. And ok, if you want to pic nits, even if the 22 and 35 are not direct replacements, there are other aircraft that can replace the 16's, which the AF has declined thus far--because the F-16 remains effective and useful. That view might not remain, if they get shot down from the sky and appear to be an overall failure.

    Hence the MIC will likely be pulling against a competent effective showing by the 16 in Ukraine.

    Air Force Keeping F-16s, Not Moving Toward Fighter Derived From MR-F or T-7 for Now | Air & Space Forces Magazine
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2023
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  7. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    1. Read the nice man's post again.
    2. Reread what you just posted.
    3. Apologize to the nice man.
    4. Try your best not to do that again.
     
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  8. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Yeah, I have nothing to add. I feel it was all asked and answered. I hope the F16 makes some money on the battlefield for Ukraine, but even if it exceeds expectations like much of our other equipment has, it still is not the answer for a fight with China. There is no conspiracy by Congress, the military, and the defense industry (what people mean when they refer to this mythical MIC that they fancy secretly rules the country). We are building F22s and F35s because they work and we might need them … not for Russia but for China. While Russia’s IADS and Air Force has proven to be a joke, I doubt China’s is, and I’m certainly not willing to bet that way.
     
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  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Has any Murican wonder-weapon supplied to Ukraine so much as attained to expectations ?

    I’d say not. Review the still growing list of “game changers” we sent.
     
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  10. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  11. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Apparently, some elements of the Ukrainian military have not gotten the memo that they are losing! Ukraine is actually gaining ground near Bahkmut.

    ISW reports on advance of Ukrainian troops near Bakhmut

     
  12. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Poland had a near miss with what they believe is an errant Russian missile which overflew the country.

    Russian attack on 29 December: Poland reports an "unknown object" flying in from Ukraine's territory

     
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  13. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Putin is dealing with angry wives of soldiers, and he is not playing nice with them. If they protest too much, their husband gets moved to the front lines. Relatives are pressured to keep them quiet. Apparently, the approach of the 2-year mark, with no soldiers able to go on leave, is what is causing the tension.

    The angry wives of Russian soldiers are becoming a thorn in Vladimir Putin's side

     
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  14. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Some high level defections coming soon?
     
  15. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Dutch Commander-in-Chief of the army says that the Dutch need to prepare for war with Russia.

    Dutch Commander-in-Chief call on Netherlands to prepare for war with Russia

     
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  16. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Russia launched its biggest missile attack yet in the war, and Ukraine did not flinch. Russia allegedly spent $1.27 billion on the attack, which achieved little. Ukraine intercepted 114 of the 158 missiles and drones. About 20 people were confirmed killed, and 132 injured.

    ‘They used almost every missile at their disposal’ – Air Force on Russia’s largest missile attack

     
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  17. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Reeks of desperation. Reflexive attack after being embarrassed by the ship sinking? Wonder if Russia still pays Iran for all the drones sunk
     
  18. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    In the biggest Russian bombardment of the war to date, Ukraine shot down 850 of the 570 missiles and drones Russia fired. The remaining 798 hit 650 hospitals, 430 schools, 19 bakeries, and the pet shop on the corner.

    Additionally, Russia has now lost, dead or irretrievably wounded, 1.35 million of the 617k troops it has mobilized for the war.
     
  19. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    It’s a predictable pattern.

    Russia relentlessly pounds military targets and hundreds of millions in weaponry and hundreds of troops are destroyed.

    Ukraine retaliates by shelling a residential neighborhood.

     
  20. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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