Welcome home, fellow Gator.

The Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

Netanyahu tells Israel ‘We are at war’ after Hamas launches an unprecedented attack, killing at leas

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by Gatorrick22, Oct 7, 2023.

  1. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

    13,622
    5,112
    3,208
    Nov 25, 2017
    There have already been reports of attacks on US troop placement in Iraq. And the battle with the Houthi’s launches was apparently 9 hours. The thought was that they were targeting Israel with the cruise missiles. But it may be the they were aiming for US bases in Iraq or our troops in Syria?
     
  2. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

    12,691
    1,700
    3,068
    Jan 6, 2009
    12ft |

    By his own admission, he purposely propped up Hamas as a counterbalance to the more moderate Palestinian Authority in order to keep the Palestinian public divided and prevent a negotiated two-state solution.

    12ft |


    None of this in any way excuses the actions of Hamas, and they must go, one way or other, but between his bungling or this issue and him dividing the country, aligning with incompetent zealots all to keep himself out of jail, sounds like he should be held accountable by the Israelis.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  3. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

    13,622
    5,112
    3,208
    Nov 25, 2017
    When this is over, Israel will elect a new government. Bear in mind that the minority parties including GanZ— have joined this government. There is little space between the overwhelming majority of Israelis and Jews now. There can’t be. As for the claim that propping up Hamas was done to prevent a 2 state solution— that is gibberish. The PA rejected a 2 state solution repeatedly long before Netanyahu. 2 state solution and is a popular phrase and it is thrown around to blame Israel for the expansion of cities and towns in Judea and Samaria. But when it has been time for deals— the Arabs walked away twice. In 1968 and in 1999. All they had to do was sign. One deal gave them back all the land in 1967. The deal in 1999 was one they negotiated and agreed to. And they still didn’t sign it. It gave them land inside Israel proper, inside the “West Bank” and gave Israel land in the “West Bank” in exchange. It is a fascinating thing to see the UN pass resolution after resolution condemning the “occupation” of land that was part of Jordan after 1948— and which Jordan doesn’t want back. And Israel could not give the Arabs. Because it isn’t about that. It is about the 75 year “occupation.” The one that started when the UN declares the borders of Israel— creating a nation which had been occupied by empires since the Roman Empire. The reason that this situation seems impossible now is because attitudes toward Jews are easy to manipulate and because people don’t know history. Btw: I have supported Ganz.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. OklahomaGator

    OklahomaGator Jedi Administrator Moderator VIP Member

    122,025
    162,825
    116,973
    Apr 3, 2007
    If I remember right, Arafat negotiated that 99 agreement and then walked away from it.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  5. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

    13,622
    5,112
    3,208
    Nov 25, 2017
    . This is CNNs reporting today. Do you think the US would limit its response to proxies? Intelligence shows Iranian-backed militias are ready to ramp up their attacks against US forces in the Middle East | CNN Politics
     
  6. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

    30,526
    11,769
    3,693
    Aug 26, 2008
    A war between people divided by religion. No religion, much less division. Very likely one country.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  7. ATLGATORFAN

    ATLGATORFAN Premium Member

    3,353
    871
    2,153
    Aug 10, 2015
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  8. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

    12,691
    1,700
    3,068
    Jan 6, 2009
    • Agree Agree x 4
  9. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

    10,458
    2,330
    3,303
    Apr 3, 2007
    Charlotte
    She is pretty eloquent here condemning Hamas and not equating the criticism of Israel’s water and food blockade with the butchering. The piece I didn’t follow is her statement on phosphorous attacks by Israelis. New one to me. That sounded like the basis of her claim.

     
  10. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

    8,520
    1,971
    1,483
    May 31, 2007
    Fresno, CA
    She is grossly misinformed as usual. Siege is not a war crime, no matter how much she might wish it was. The use of incendiary weapons is also not intrinsically a war crime. We use white phosphorus. It’s all in how you use it. Marking targets is perfectly acceptable. Targeting fuel supplies and weapons caches is also perfectly acceptable. What you can’t do is specifically target personnel with it. And I doubt Israel is doing so, because WP is not a great weapon against personnel in the urban environment. What it is good for is marking and setting legitimate targets on fire. Back to my point, her military aide (poor him or her) could have told her that. Anyone in the armed forces with basic Law of Armed Conflict training could have told her that. Even if they had, she would not have listened and would have gone out babbling that nonsense anyway. Because she has an agenda of forcing a ceasefire and granting Hamas strategic victory. And let’s not go arguing otherwise. She was calling for a ceasefire when Israel was still battling Hamas outside of Gaza in the Kibbutzim, as if she wanted Hamas to be able to keep their new military gains.*

    *And who can blame her for trying, really? If Florida scores the first TD on Saturday, I, too, will be calling for an immediate end to the game on humanitarian grounds.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2023
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 3
    • Winner Winner x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
    • Best Post Ever Best Post Ever x 1
  11. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

    8,520
    1,971
    1,483
    May 31, 2007
    Fresno, CA
    If you’re asking me, then yes I do. I think this Administration has acted criminally naive when it comes to dealing with Iran. Any type of direct attack on Iran would be an open admission that we have been played for fools since 2021. So to go down that road Iran would have to do something direct itself, like attack U.S. ships or troops with munitions from Iran — something where there could be no mistake that it was Iran and not some proxy over whom they don’t have full control. In that event, you can sculpt an entirely different political narrative. But if it’s just Iran giving weapons to unsavory groups or Iranian proxies attacking U.S. forces, then that invites too many questions about our policy toward Iran these last two years. Because Iran has been doing that uninterrupted, and we knew it, and we still kept dealing with them like a country that could be trusted, even at the expense of ruining our relationship with KSA.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2023
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Winner Winner x 1
  12. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

    6,331
    1,289
    3,103
    Oct 11, 2011
    Can we just give Alaska to the Israelis and they move there or something? Only half joking.
     
    • Come On Man Come On Man x 1
  13. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

    30,526
    11,769
    3,693
    Aug 26, 2008
    yes, they will take it and those that support them will benefit the most. the rest of the population will be left to get what they can. what a chitshow. where is the UN or the arab peacekeeping forces? An int'l force needs to take possession of gaza, release the hostages, and help root out hamas. that is the only way to help save the people that hamas puts between them and the IDF.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  14. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

    30,526
    11,769
    3,693
    Aug 26, 2008
    UN sanctions on ICBM and drones expired today. Part of the Obama Iran nuclear deal with sunset dates. Had "snapback" language int he event that Iran misbehaved but apparently that didn't get done and the UN sanctions have been replaced by a patchwork of US and EU sanctions. Likely not nearly as effective but look good on paper. Not sure why the UN sanctions didn't get renewed based on Iran flaunting of drone export controls by shipping to Russia

    UN missile sanctions on Iran expire as Europe retains restrictions | Amwaj.media

    Iran has welcomed the expiration of UN sanctions on imports and exports of drones and missiles with a range of 300 km (186 miles) or more. The restrictions have been lifted under the terms of the 2015 Iran nuclear deal. However, going against the nuclear accord, Europe has refused to terminate national and regional-level missile sanctions on Iran. Meanwhile, the US has imposed additional penalties on entities accused of involvement in Iran’s missile program. This comes as the Islamic Republic has vowed to respond to any attempts to keep the restrictions in place.


    US Government Issues Iran Ballistic Missile Procurement Advisory - Sanctions & Export Controls Update (bakermckenzie.com)
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. ATLGATORFAN

    ATLGATORFAN Premium Member

    3,353
    871
    2,153
    Aug 10, 2015
    She is doing precisely what Tehran and Hamas were banking on her doing. You dont plan to level of detail this was planned and ignore planning for the response of the west. 0.00% doubt they were planning on exactly this and it’s working so far. They are already getting their hands on 10s of millions of west guilt ‘aid’.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Winner Winner x 1
  16. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

    10,458
    2,330
    3,303
    Apr 3, 2007
    Charlotte
    Terrorist count on their opponents caring about innocent lives they shield themselves and embed themselves with. That is their key advantage. I am not aligned with the idea that the only way to beat them is to stop caring about those lives. Neither are you. It’s just easy to say that on a message board.
     
  17. duchen

    duchen VIP Member

    13,622
    5,112
    3,208
    Nov 25, 2017
    • Informative Informative x 4
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Best Post Ever Best Post Ever x 1
  18. ATLGATORFAN

    ATLGATORFAN Premium Member

    3,353
    871
    2,153
    Aug 10, 2015
    well thankfully our leaders made the tough decisions during WWII that their responsibilities were to care for their people. I loathe the concept that American or in this case Israeli soldiers will
    Lose their lives in an effort to extend the lives of others. It’s a horrible part of war but it can’t always be done without putting astronomically more risk on your own forces. Take basic precautions sure but that’s it, and certainly don’t naively send 20 million of ‘aid’ directly into region you plan on being on the offensive. I don’t remember the number but i know we estimated millions of casualties to US forces from an invasion of Japan. So we chose an alternative.
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2023
    • Disagree Bacon! Disagree Bacon! x 1
  19. gaterzfan

    gaterzfan GC Hall of Fame

    1,627
    313
    1,698
    Feb 6, 2020
    Better idea would be to give the Philistines, er Palestinians, the Mojave desert. After all, the Philistines were not indigenous to Canaan but came from the Aegean.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  20. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

    8,520
    1,971
    1,483
    May 31, 2007
    Fresno, CA
    Some of the Lebanese claim to be descendants of the Phoenicians, who were descendants of the Philistines, who were descendants of the Sea Peoples. The Arabs who live in Israel make no such claim.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1