Netanyahu tells Israel ‘We are at war’ after Hamas launches an unprecedented attack, killing at leas

Nailed it. That’s a perfect analogy.

 

No. Japan has zero Palestinian immigrants. Just seemed like a weird comparison when there are 2 billion of them and many in America. There was no large violent protests in the US.

Whoa. A woman broke a dudes finger in some incident is your example? The media played up the protests and it was a big nothing. There were very few protests, no violence, a lot of passion, and some outlier crazies.

The whole tweet was to suggest there was some deep seated tolerant support of the barbarism of Hamas in the US. I disagree.

 

Meh. Colleges weren’t overrun with protests. None were shut down because it got too bad as it was suggested in the tweet. One college that was referred to simply shut down as a precaution, not because it got “too bad”. Very few protests actually occurred and very few had any meaningful attendance. Tweet was bullshit. I appreciate your lecture but the tweet was misleading as I challenged. Your straw man about feelings regarding the protesters and that you are offended has nothing to do with whether that tweet was accurate.

 

Perhaps, but that analogy does not illustrate the universal disgust as does the vision of a bunch of KKK or neo-Nazis celebrating and/or justifying the great victory of murdering 1000 black people, including infants, in their homes. I’m expressing how seeing the pro-Hamas celebrations makes me feel. I think the American Jewish population has been remarkably restrained in the face of these unbelievably insulting displays.

 

Not looking to argue or lecture, just to put the situation in perspective. As I’ve said, I think the government should be doing more, as it did during Charlottesville, to disperse these demonstrations before our Jewish population loses patience and acts out violently.

 

The point of the post was Japan supports Israel unlike the morally corrupt groups in the US supporting Palestine. And, yes, anyone taking any other side than Israel here is corrupt and blind. Our highest academic institutions in this land are the breeding pool for all manner of corrupt ideologies.

 

The whole country of Japan has 82 palestinians. The US has 170,000. Im not going to debate the difference between being a Palestinian and a Hamas Terrorist since it seems futile.

https://www.mofa.go.jp/region/middle_e/palestine/data.html

 

Not sure what you are referencing. Pretty sure people were beaten and killed in Charlottesville before it was dispersed...wasnt done preemptively. If I remember correctly. There is little our government can do to limit protests that people think are in bad taste. I believe there are laws that do not allow groups to intimidate though and that would be the line.

 

I like Yuval and thought folks might get some things out of this discussion.

 

In large measure, American Jews are not going to respond violently to people who demonstrate in support of people who slice throats of, and burn, babies. Americans, like you, in large measure, understand who they are and what they stand for.

For the most part, the pro-Hamas demonstrations were small.

 

The US is sending a second carrier group to the Mediterranean, in addition to the group in the Persian Gulf near Hormmuz. I have also read of aircraft being deployed to the middle east

Clearly there is a concern about a broader conflict. iran has been building a bridge toward Israel through Iraq and Syria for a number of years.

What are the strategic reasons for such a strong naval/air power presence?

 

Deterrence. That is my hack amateur guess.

 

Huge fan of Yuval. That was a great listen. Thanks for posting.

 

Agree. I think the message to Iran is that if Hezbollah intervenes on a large scale (a massive missile attack designed to overwhelm the Iron Dome system and/or using the more advanced longer range missiles provided by Iran) American forces will intervene in Lebanon and possibly Syria on the part of Israel.

 

While Biden was ignorant to unfreeze the $6 Billion, I do think he is doing the right thing here.

Our #1 core objective here is to keep this conflict as small as possible. There is a pathway for this to become WWIII. That pathway involves the conflict expanding in the Middle East. If Iran gets involved, then their allies might as well, including China and Russia.

We really don’t want 3 fronts: Ukraine, Israel, and Taiwan. 3 aircraft carriers in the region sends a message. It gives Iran and Syria some serious consequences to think about.

 

A moral position doesn't require taking a side other than against terrorism and violence. It's terribly misguided when in identifying with the plight of ordinary Palestinians and Israelis turns anger into support for or excusing of violence.

 

I am aware of this. But 1 carrier group sends a message. My question was more operational. Bear in mind that the US has its national interest in this, including in Iraq, Syria and in containing Iran.

 

Jared Kushner | Swamp Gas Forums

I started a separate thread on this but I thought one thing Jared Kushner said in his dealings in the Middle East that solving the Gaza situation theoretically could have been fairly easy, because a lot of the Arab countries and other parties would have been willing to fund a reconstruction of Gaza, but nobody would do so because none them them trusted Hamas.

Also he said he felt pretty certain that if they were still in office this wouldn’t have happened. While normally I would roll my eyes at that, Kushner seems very credible in the discussion of these issues. He basically said when they handed off to Biden administration they went a different direction and fumbled around the first couple of years in the Middle East until more recently when they started getting back on track. I think his rationale saying it would not have happened was primarily that Trump really strangled Iran economically and Biden eased up some, partially to get more oil to offset Saudi cuts (which also was partly due to Saudi relationship early bungling )

 

War is the only response to what happened. If the government of Gaza surrenders that is one thing, but that is not happening right now. The government of Gaza must be deposed just like the Nazi government of Germany was deposed in WWII. Innocent people will die, but there are ways to go about war ethically and unethically. You try to minimize the loss of innocent lives, but not to the point where any response is impossible. The tactics being used by Hamas here put the blood of innocents on the heads of Hamas not Israel. The fact that Netanyahu has warned civilians in Gaza is evidence that he is considering these things. As I have said there are some difficult decisions being made here, but they have to be made. Israel has to defend itself.

 

My comment was to your argument that it was morally corrupt if one doesn't take any side other than w/Israel. It's a false dichotomy. People can be against terrorism and rightly horrified by Hamas' bloodshed and support the rights & humanity of fellow humans in Gaza as they do the rights & humanity of fellow humans in Israel.

Certainly Hamas has to be ended. They are a true threat to both Israel and ordinary Palestinians. Same time, I don't subscribe to notions that bombing the heck out of Gaza is so easily excused by "we warned civilians to head south."