The cost of college is one thing. There's also a debate about the value of certain degrees. It's also true that there's a lot of money that can be made in various trades and fields for which no formal education is required. At the same time, I sense that a lot of political types who often mock college themselves have one or more degrees. I suspect most of them are also encouraging their children and grand children to go to college. Is it one of those things where people want their own kids to go to college for the status it provides but don't actually think it's worth it? Maybe they want college graduates in their families but want to convince others it doesn't matter? I am curious how many people there might be on this board who actually discouraged their kids or grand kids to skip college and save the money?
Is political leaning the significant variable in this equation though? I'd argue one's own upbringing plays a more important role. Anecdotally I have several friends who are discouraging their own kids from going the college route because their own career paths didn't include it so they view it as less useful. I can only assume that I'm not the only one. It goes right back to the ROI on the cost of a degree vs lifetime earnings differential. There is a significantly larger ratio of 1099 jobs vs W-2 jobs than there were just 20 years ago. Or am I misunderstanding your query? Because as I understood it, you're looking for a political correlation.
I suspect (and could be wrong) that much of the rhetoric knocking higher education and the benefits of a degree might be more political than truly reflective of what people expect or advocate when it comes to their own kids (or their own educational background). Your point about peoples' different life experiences is fair, too. Of course, there appears to be a growing partisan divide in terms of formal education levels. Personally, I don't recall ever considering not going to college. I did wonder about whether law school made sense. I seem to remember my dad telling me that having the JD and being a member of the Bar helped him greatly in his career even though he never practiced law. His view was also that getting a degree would only result in more doors being left open, rather than fewer; it's simply a requirement for some jobs and fields. Of course, Florida's public higher ed was and remains a great value relative to what people pay at a lot of private schools, and that has to be factored in as well.
As a personal experience, I actually did seriously consider not going to college immediately after HS. I was tempted to enlist in the military and go that route instead. I was a good student, albeit a lazy one which was my (lack of) motivation for continuing my education. In addition, I really didn't know what I wanted to be or do with my life. My parents of course disagreed with me on that and in the end were able to convince me otherwise. There was no partisan lean then and I truly don't believe there is one now. I think it still comes down to what parents see as the most benefit for their kids. I could be wrong there as well, but it just makes more sense to me that the belief and will as a parent wanting the best for their kids would outweigh the outright pigheadedness of a simple political leaning. That is to say that people by and large are still more self motivated than politically motivated.
That was the point. Try getting a job at a U.S. Airline company or flying for the military without one even though you don’t need one. The point is to get hired ya better have one.
I think I can settle this debate. I work with a lot of current and former military pilots and pilot instructors. The math equation here is very simple. You cannot be a pilot in the military without being an officer and you cannot be an officer without a college degree. The only exception here is piloting a UAV. Not only that, but one also cannot deploy ordnance without being an officer. In addition, the major airlines pull heavily from the military ranks for their pilots (in point of fact, Delta is notorious for it). So @citygator is absolutely right in this regard.
It never occurred to me that not going to college was an option. My parents always instilled a sense that education was the most important thing. Of course this was way before the internet so wasn’t aware of other options
25 years practicing law, representing every kind of client from dirt poor criminal defendants and bankruptcy clients, to filthy rich small business owners and sophisticated estate planning clients, and the inescapable conclusion that I've arrived at, is that formal education is stupidly over rated. My wealthiest clients boast of negligible paper...as do my poorest clients. Certainly the middle group favors better $$$ corresponding to their education level, but not overwhelmingly such as to scream for the value of paper. I have robotically guided my kids towards pursuing education... but been quite adamant in communicating to them, how negotiable it is for their long term *success*. So my take is get you some paper bc being educated is better than not being educated....but don't lose perspective over it, and damn sure don't over pay for any paper. Money first--(that is, you do NOT go to college without an ironclad plan to pay for it. Period). Education is a luxury not a necessity. Finally, I'll simply point out that the question of education has to begin with: what constitutes education? A few examples of ppl who were educated, but unpapered: Abe Lincoln Mark Twain Louis L'Amour Steve Jobs Bill Gates Mark Zuckerberg Oprah Rachel Ray Alicia Keys Paul Allen Jimmy Buffett Frank Lloyd Wright Henry Ford Dave Thomas Ben Hill Griffin jr John D. Rockefeller Andrew Carnegie ... Start with the truth that education is mastering valuable skills and obtaining valuable knowledge--continue to college is merely an institutionalized means to achieve the end of obtaining valuable skills and knowledge--not THE means. ...proceed accordingly.
30% of commercial pilots do mot have college degrees. Less than 10% are female. I could make a more compelling case for needing a penis than a degree to be a pilot.
Not true at all. Many high end pilots did not go to college. I have several friends that flew/fly in the military and are also working for Delta or AA. One flys for FedEx and makes weious bank. No college degree needed. Another friend flew a jet for the Coast Guard. Start flying when he was 16, joined the CG and made 159,000k back in the 90s.
Not only did they go to college… against their better judgement, and posts here, they are sending their kids to college. I mean… what is more right wing than arguing others shouldn’t send their kids to college then sending your own?!?!?!
To what extent should we consider a recognition that "for profit" colleges aren't all that they're cracked up to be: U.S. College Enrollment Decline: Facts and Figures | BestColleges Go GATORS! ,WESGATORS
This is a really interesting article and provides a lot more color to the assertion that college is becoming less popular. To the extent for profit enrollment has fallen off a cliff is probably a good thing. Also demographics / lower birth rates may be playing a role. I’m curious what is driving the drop off in 2 year public college enrollment? Community college enrollment plunges nearly 40 percent in a decade
For profit colleges are a scam and shouldn’t get federal funding. The default rates are insanely high. Their lobby is crooked.
How long have they been pilots? I suppose it's possible the commercial requirements are less stringent. There's no way they were USAF pilots unless the requirement was relaxed in the last few years as I specifically asked for and received the above information from a former pilot instructor about two minutes before I posted it.
Jimmy Buffett had a college degree from the University of Southern Mississippi. He was a history major
OT: How do you feel about Udemy's Python courses? I'm not a dev guy, but I have been mulling over learning Python.
