#TrumpMugShot

The sole reason indictments have come about to deal with the criminality is because the attempt was a failure. Had it succeeded there would have been no indictments or arrests for these crimes.

 

Sorry, the numbers and the truth aren't working well for Democrats.
The Biden Administration has spent $11 trillion in the last 2 years.
Biden admitted the Inflation Reduction Act doesn't reduce inflation.
The BLS has overestimated the job creation for the past year too.

 

Can't say I didn't try to help you.

 

that is what I thought…

 

question: what level of fraud is acceptable to you?

 

I'm not sure whether this is one of the rare times in which we are in agreement. The narrative of the right-wing media (Fox, OAN and Newsmax commentators, "conservative" web and print publications, and high profile "conservative" posters on social media) as well as most Republican officeholders is that Trump is being prosecuted for what he has said when it's really because of what has he actually did. If he simply complained about the 2020 campaign as Hillary Clinton did about the 2016 campaign or Stacy Abrams did regarding her two losing two Georgia elections or even if he just ranted with his false narrative of massive voter fraud he would have never been prosecuted nor were he and his high profile supporters prosecuted over their multiple frivolous lawsuits or the multiple costly recounts that they demanded. They are being prosecuted over the illegal fake elector scheme, their attempt to prevent the certification of the electoral vote, their harassment of election workers, and their attempt to tamper with voting machines among other charges (adding the qualifier that not all of the allegations apply to all of the defendants).

 

Enough to make a difference in an election. In Maricopa County, AZ, where I live, votes were counted, recounted, audited, and audited again. Every time, same result. Biden won. The final numbers weren't exactly the same in any count, but plus or minus 50 votes in an election decided by over 10,000 votes? Not a problem.

Now, had the election been decided between less than 100 votes, different story. But how rare does that happen in a race with millions of votes? Almost as rare as voter fraud itself!

Be nice to always get it perfect. But does it matter at all if a candidate wins by 10,450 votes, 10,500 votes, or 10,550 votes? Certainly doesn't change the outcome.

Now, about the illegal scheme to give VP Pence unconstitutional powers, and allow for fraudulent electors to illegally replace duly elected ones, any comments? I'd again suggest reading the GA and last Smith indictments first.

 

While no level of fraud is "acceptable" it's absurd to use the minute amount of fraud that had absolutely no effect on the outcome of an election as a rationale for attempting to prevent the peaceful transition of power, defaming election workers who were legally performing their duties, trying to persuade state officials to find non-existent votes or to concoct a scheme using fake electors. By the way there was most likely an equal amount of fraud on both sides with the net result being a wash.
4th resident of The Villages admits to voting twice in the 2020 election
Man admits to voter fraud in casting dead mother's ballot for Trump
Trump’s own research showed that voter fraud did not cost him election – report

 

Help is on the way for your Party.
It's called No Labels.

 

Says the attorney (???) asking a layman to explain the law to him.

 

All lies. But it’s pretty bush league, you aren’t in the class of Goebbles, Ramaswarmy or even Baghdad Bob.

Try harder…

 

LOL. How the F do you (or anyone) know with any level of certainty whether the amount of fraud (voter fraud, election worker fraud, lax rule enforcement, etc) would have made a difference? The answer is YOU DONT. The only way to determine that is to investigate, and even then it is nearly impossible. You are hanging your argument on the number of people caught engaging in election fraud. Do you also believe the number of illegal immiigrants in this country is the number of those caught at the border?

For me, my voter fraud tolerance is ZERO. The penalty for personal voter fraud should be 2 year minimum on prison. Fraudelent scheme should be 5 year minimum. Official misconduct 10 year minimum. Until we start putting people in jail for this crap accross the board, we do not have fair elections. If we as a country cant agree to this, then all the other crap about elections is irrelvant.

If Trump commited an election crime which cancelled my vote or your vote, then throw the SOB in prison...but be consisitent and throw all the other people who commited election crimes in prison too. ALL OF THEM. Until I see indictments across the board, then I will view the charges against Trump with great skepticism as they appear to be nothing but politically motivated.

 

I agree with the first 7 words of your post. Baby steps....

You have bought into the unproven narrative that election fraud did not make a difference.

Every election its the same Friggin thing. Why is it so difficult to get everyone to agree that there should be zero tolerence for voter fraud. Our elections are a joke.

 

Has anything good ever come from the villages?

 

While it's impossible to prove with an absolute certainty that election fraud did not make difference that are have been multiple reviews which reached that conclusion.
AP review finds far too little vote fraud to tip 2020 election to Trump
The Myth of Voter Fraud
Exhaustive fact check finds little evidence of voter fraud, but 2020's 'Big Lie' lives on
Republicans Increasingly Realize There’s No Evidence Of Election Fraud—But Most Still Think 2020 Election Was Stolen Anyway, Poll Finds
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/3559758-https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2103619118

Since you believe that there should be zero tolerance of voter fraud, do you believe that those residents of the Villages found to have knowingly voted twice should been sentenced to prison terms rather being given the opportunity to avoid incarceration through a pretrial diversion program? Same for that man in Pennsylvania who knowingly cast a vote for Trump on behalf of his mother and avoided a prison term through a plea deal in which he received probation? Interestingly, two cases of people who were sentenced to prison for voter fraud that immediately come to mind were minority women who voted based on a mistake. One was a Black woman in Tennessee who had been convicted of a felony and was incorrectly advised by the county voting registrar that her right to vote had been restored (her conviction was later reversed by the way), the other person was a legal Hispanic immigrant in Texas who incorrectly assumed that her green card gave the her to vote.

 

The votes were counted, audited, counted again, and audited again. All results came with a .00000025% accuracy of each other in Maricopa County. A difference of no more than 50 votes in over 2 million.

If there was some sort of fraud, on a large scale, that evades multiple counts and audits, without a single trace of evidence, I'd be shocked. Crime on that scale is very hard to conceal, especially over multiple states.

As for Trump, he had an illegal scheme that had it worked, would have canceled my vote. If any other politician were in the past, or in the future to engage in any similar scheme, I would hope first, it fails, and second, charges would be filed. Have any example of anyone attempting what Trump did in 2020 and not being prosecuted?

I'm not talking about words. I'm talking actions. Full, fledged out schemes with co-conspirators. If you can't come up with any examples, then please stop with the both sides do it.

 

He's trying his best to equate what Trump and his co-conspirators did to some rando casting two ballots ... as if trying to nullify millions of ballots across 5 states is just run of the mill voter fraud.

 

not sure I can be clearer on this. All voter fraud should be prosecuted, and all persons, regardless of status, who have been convicted of voter fraud/election fraud should be jailed. No exceptions. The way to stop this crap is to prosecute and jail people. If a prosecuter refuses to bring the charges, then private citizens should be able to step into their place, with fee shifting in place for the prevailing party.

 

There are dozens of ways that people can engage in "election fraud" (which is a better term because it is broader). Using a vote count to determine election fraud is akin to using arrests to determine the murder rate.

See response above. Election fraud can occur by throwing away votes before they are counted, as one of a zillion examples.

1960 Hawaii the dems put forth "apparent" false electors at the time of submission, but after a recount the votes swung from Nixon to Kennedy. Not the same thing exactly, but the principle was the same. Regardless, if you think Trump could have "stolen" the election by the "scheme" you describe, I have to chuckle because I can't take you seriously. It would have had the same effect if he put on a biden mask.

 

Sincere question for you. If the plan had literally zero chance of changing the outcome, why do you think they spent the time and money they did on it? Because Trump’s ego wouldn’t allow him to admit he lost? Because they knew they could make it an issue for the 2022 and 2024 elections? Because Trump was trying bait the Feds into indicting him and his team?

What do you imagine they identified as the upsides?