Supreme Court rejects affirmative action at colleges, says schools can’t consider race in admission

She was indeed chosen because she’s black. That was a promise Biden made, to make history with the first qualified black woman.

Do you think that makes her legal opinion less valid, or makes her inherently less qualified than the other justices? I think you are treading on some ugly territory here.

 

Yep. And your point is?

 

That’s what he claimed. Problem with that is far more republicans supported the civil rights bill then democrats.

Completely ignored how he changed his views overtime huh.

 

If that is the case, explain how “she was chosen because she was black” has any relevance as a statement when criticizing her legal argument? I clicked that link claiming to nuke her dissent and saw zero actual legal argument. Seems like a low blow, yes I know the women who made the comment is also black

 

And you keep ignoring context. Well done

 

Rough day for progressives.

 

You can’t shift the burden of proof. He asserted on multiple occasions that a colorblind society should result in university attendance that matches the diversity of the state. The onus is on him to justify that assertion.

 

I am not answering a question with a question. You made the initial assertion and I’m asking you to defend that assertion. You cannot explain an assertion by merely making the same assertion over again. There is no reason to automatically believe that a colorblind society results in everything in life being distributed equally and proportionally among the demographic groups.

The prison population complaint is one of the most illogical. If the government randomly picked people from society to place into prisons, then the prison population would represent the demographics of the general society.

But that’s not the basis for going to prison. The basis for being sent to prison is the commission of crimes. If Martians make up 5% of the population, but commit 50% of the crimes, then the prison population in a colorblind society would be 50% Martian.

The same holds for college admissions. You cannot automatically take for granted that if everyone had the same socio-economic status, then everybody would go to college in the same proportion as their demographic. There’s no evidence to show that’s true.

If you have evidence to show that your assertion is true, I would like to see that evidence and, if convincing, I will change my opinion (something not often done on too hot). However, you cannot back up an assertion by merely rewording it and making the same assertion again.

 

Correct keeping in mind that most of those Republicans would be considered RINOs by the standards of today's Republican Party and if Southern Democrats who would be Republicans today were excluded virtually no Democrats voted against against the legislation.

 

why do African Americans commit more crimes or perform worse on college admissions tests?

 

What we have here is the age-old nature vs. nurture debate. My take is given the same inputs, you would eventually see similar outputs along racial lines. Hell in 1000 years there probably won’t even be “races” so much as we now define them. In our lifetimes, whites will become minority. Should probably consider that before undoing civil rights type protections.

If you reject the idea that all races have the same potential if given a blank slate, inherently you must believe some races are genetically predisposed to academic success. Or that they are genetically predisposed to commit crimes. That is the obvious inference. There is certainly plenty of academic evidence at an individual level genetics play a role in academic prowess, although “nurture” also plays a role. But at a race level? You just accept it as matter of fact?

I was merely posing the question, i wasn’t trying to set a trap for you. But I did find your responses odd. Like… take a stand… is it genetic or is it socioeconomic starting point? If you believe it’s the former, I can see why you would prefer to make an insane deflection to “Martians” rather than answer honestly.

 

Please do not put things into my posts that were never there. I have never said anything about genetic abilities of races. I would never agree with anyone who says that a given race is genetically inferior. Please do not insinuate that somehow I said that.

Please do not spin the Rolodex of Prejudice and pull out a card that you imagine someone thinks, when there’s no evidence whatsoever that they think that. Unfortunately, that happens on too hot all the time.

Not sure exactly what you mean by a blank slate, or even social economic status. There are cultural effects in communities. Over the years I’ve read on multiple occasions of minorities who said that they were harassed and mocked for wanting to do well at school. That’s cultural not economic.

I don’t see how in the world you could ever create a blank slate for everybody. They live in communities, and those communities have cultural value, and it is up to the community to decide what those values are.

It sounds like you’re saying that if somehow everyone could be placed on the same economic level, that they would all perform equally. I don’t know that that’s true.

 

Ok, Kennedy would virtually be a republican with todays standards.

you are trying to bring comparisons in completely different times that’s impossible to compare. The internet and social media alone has dramatically changed in how individuals view the world or form strong opinions.

Anyhow, democrats claims to some great party switch always falls very flat.

 

Putting aside whether an analogy between different skin colors versus completely alien life forms is helpful, this seems to ignore not only hundreds of years of official oppression but also more modern racial profiling, a lesser financial ability to bond out and hire private lawyers, sentencing disparities, and implicit biases of many judges and juries that’s hard quantify.

We could go on. The vast majority of White people I know have committed a crime of one sort or another, as I bet most on this board have.

 

About three years ago on this board I used FBI data to back up the assertion that prison incarceration rates even among races tracked pretty well to socioeconomic status. I don’t have the energy to look up or post the entire thing again, but it absolutely tracks.

Maybe I should do the same for college attendance/admissions.

Because if you’re asserting that Martians (i.e. Black folks) are going to prison at higher rates for no reasons other than human nature it would be reasonable that one would project you’d say Black folks lag in college admissions for the same reasons, which…

 

Hence the question I posed. Which instead of addressing, you deflected to.. Martians.

The discrepancies are there. Explain them. If you cannot explain them, how can you be confident some degree of affirmative action or community investment is not actually warranted?

My take is also not that every individual has the same potential. We know that not to be true. Genetics matter. But I think when incarceration rate is 5x different across entire races of people, and pretty much across the board there are measurable socioeconomic discrepancies, some ‘splainin is required before declaring a post racial utopia. You disagree?

 

Speaking of the “internet and social media”, the first time i saw “democrats were the party of slavery” used as a taking point was a result of a D’nsh DeSouza propaganda film that became popular in alt-right circles. It seemed pretty laughable to me anyone would be dumb enough to ignore historical context for this “rewrite”, but as you say…”different times”.

If you seriously doubt the history as to the parties flipping over civil rights, there is a gaping hole in your logic. Which party is presently trying to undermine and undo civil rights gains? Hint: it’s not the democrats.

 

The incarceration rate and some of the measurable socioeconomic discrepancies can certainly be tied, in part, to the fact that this particular race was enslaved for centuries and we are only a couple of generations removed from the Civil Rights era. There is definitely validity to that. At the same time, lowering admission standards isn't the way to fix it. Affirmative action is a passive aggressive middle finger to blacks, because the government is saying "we know you can't manage this on your own, so we're going to intervene." Once people figure out they can advance without government bringing in the fences 100 feet for them, those people are no longer dependent and the government doesn't have the hold on them they once did.