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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    After Prigozhin's mutiny, another Russian ultranationalist said that Putin must 'transfer' his war powers if he can't win in Ukraine

    So is his demonstration in Moscow organized by an ultranationalist demanding Putin give up his war powers a psy op also?
     
  2. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Still dreaming about the tank and four APC's that Russia took out in the first few days of the counter-offensive. Gee, I wonder why Russia hasn't repeated that little success, yet keeps dragging out pictures of it over and over again.

    Wagner was the only Russian outfit worth a damn in this war. And Prigo was the only person capable of leading a group of mercenaries and convicts to military victories. The convicts will not like being second-class citizens in Russia's regular army, and will have fights with army soldiers. More chaos on the front lines, and more failure for Russia.

    Like it or not, Ukraine is winning this war. They are slowly advancing through Russian defenses, and eventually, there will be no more Russian defenses for Russia's army to hide behind. Then they will run screaming back to Moscow. Ukraine is steadily advancing with only one fourth of their armored brigades. Once they break through, the other nine brigades will advance and get behind Russia's lines and either put them out of their misery, or starve them into submission. Your defeat is coming. It's just a matter of time.
     
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  3. Sohogator

    Sohogator GC Hall of Fame

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  4. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Condoleeza Rice agrees that the coup was not staged. No way does Putin do something that makes himself look so weak.

    Condoleezza Rice Tells Fox News She Considered ‘Ruse’ Theory of Wagner Coup – But It Gives Putin ‘Too Much Credit’ (Video)

     
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  5. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Defense minister Shoigu was shown in a video that indicated that he is hard at work making military plans after the coup. One small detail: a watch in the picture was blurred out. It is suspected that the video was made some time ago, and the watch indicated the date. Oh, what a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive. Another lie from the Kremlin. Can Russia release any information without lying?

    Putin's embattled defense minister, Shoigu, appeared in a video released after the Wagner mutiny that experts say is confusing and feels off

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Looks like intensified battle over potential flanking breakthrough

     
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  7. vaxcardinal

    vaxcardinal GC Hall of Fame

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    Of course the watch is proof it was staged. Although it seems there would be better proof if the image of the watch wasn’t so blurry
     
  8. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    I believe you are correct as to the younger Russians, especially the ones with full internet access through a VPN. As to the older Russians, you are not correct. They get their information from Russian state TV and largely believe what they are told.

    Go watch some of this guy's videos.

    https://www.youtube.com/@1420channel/videos
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2023
  9. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Remind me: between the two groups, which one does Putin need to fight his war and stay in power?
     
  10. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Apart from patiently chewing threw Ukraine’s third army (and much of its Western wunderwaffe) I’ll concede that Russia hasn’t made much headway.
     
  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    On Jan 6 2021 a gaggle of unarmed selfie-taking eccentrics paralyzed the Capitol of the mighty US and traumatized multitudes of Americans.
     
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  12. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    Putin is going to stay in power until something unpleasant happens to him. It will not be the result of a lost election.
     
  13. okeechobee

    okeechobee GC Hall of Fame

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    If we’re being honest about it, was Putin’s move to unite the mercenary groups with contracts under the MoD a bad move for Russia long term? Probably not. As we can see, relying on mercenaries to prosecute a war is a dicey proposition. I believe Putin allowed it for a while, because from his standpoint “hey, if we can recruit from our prisons, I’d rather sacrifice those bodies than non-criminal young adults.” Once Wagner took out Bakhmut, their relevance was greatly reduced. Some estimating Wagner forces were down to 8,000 troops.

    So even if this “coup” was legit, it’s a small sacrifice from Putin’s standpoint to win a broader war at home and in Ukraine. Probably better long term for Putin to coalesce his military rather than have factions. And Putin can blame the West for the coup. If you don’t think that has any relevance, explain why Biden felt compelled to announce yesterday that we had no part in it?

    And to be completely fair, probably better for the United States long term that Putin did this as well. Putin, for all his obvious faults, is a statesman. Imagine trying to negotiate a nuclear crisis with a guy like Prigozhin. If Putin can maintain control of Russia and bring all the mercenary groups under control of the MoD, that’s a good thing for the world. Last thing we need is the country with the largest stockpile of nuclear warheads being run by a nutso warlord, who obviously lacks diplomatic skill.
     
  14. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    No doubt. Especially considering they don’t have actual elections there. At any rate, it will still be the young population that affects any change, pleasant or not.
     
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  15. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  16. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  17. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Precisely. Which group is more likely to protest, set cars on fire and break windows, young people or old?
     
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  18. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Consider then, for a moment, the actual scene in Russia …

    A miles-long armored column was driving towards the capital. What was the response from the Russian state and people?

    Authorities at all levels publicly denounced the uprising and stated support for the president. There were no defections, either from military units or civilian administration.

    There was no civil unrest, no looting, no loss of even basic government control in the country.

    *Compare to our own bloody and horrific Summer of 2020.
     
  19. GatorJMDZ

    GatorJMDZ gatorjack VIP Member

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    Absolutely. If you have a minute, watch some of the YT videos in my link above, repeated here.:

    https://www.youtube.com/@1420channel/videos

    That young Russian man has a lot of balls. He sets up in various Russian locations asking people about the special/conflict war, Putin, attitudes toward Ukraine and the US and a lot of other topics that surprise me. In his latest one about Russia being ranked 160 out of 180 in terms of free press countries, he even introduced himself by his first and last name and used "not in jail yet" for his middle name. A lot of people refuse or are quite reluctant to answer his poll questions out of fear, but many do. The older Russians, with some exceptions, are all in on the official party line. Younger Russians tend to be more questioning/condemning of Putin's actions, but even among the younger set, a surprisingly large percentage are also all in.

    It all looks legit to me, I do not get the sense it is staged.
     
  20. oragator1

    oragator1 Premium Member

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    It’s not that it’s staged, it’s that probably half the people backing Putin there are doing it so they don’t get hauled off to jail the next day when the video posts.