Murder of Jordan Neely on the Subway

I saw video of it - at least part of the video; the one I saw wasn't very long. There seems to be some confusion about the timeline and whether and to what extent Neely was throwing stuff at people and being threatening or just being loud and experiencing clear mental health issues.

I've read that the medical examiner ruled the cause of death a homicide. I'm not sure if any charges have been announced at this point, but my gut is that there will be. Perhaps manslaughter and not murder, but who knows. This reminds me a bit of the Rittenhouse case where everybody had their minds made up very early on.

 

You can just kill people on the subway now I guess? Very disturbing. Last time I was in Chicago there was a clearly mentally ill man just saying nonsense at a high volume on the train. People just ignored him, though I cant say people were necessarily "comfortable." Its not ideal seeing people who are in that state, being confronted by the deliberate choices of society for things like that to be possible. I suppose one solution is literally killing them when they bother you, America is a cruel place, and I'm not surprised there are people that defend the murder of this man.

 

That guy needs some jail time even though I'm sure it was unintentional.

 

I don’t know. Seems to me to say it’s “murder” before sorting out all the facts is premature. You don’t have the right to throw shit at people on the subway and threaten them. The appropriateness of the marines actions are dependent on the level of inappropriateness of the victim. Apparently he had a history of harassing people.

I’m not going to jump to conclusions either way at this point. I don’t think Adams said it was “OK”.

 

2 other people were reportedly helping restrain Neely as well. Do they get charged as well? Also, Neely had been arrested 40 times including a current outstanding warrant for felony battery?

What kind of behavioral or criminal history if any do the people restraining him have? Do they have a Propensity for violence themselves?

So many unanswered questions at this point. IF Neely was violent and not simply just loud or disorderly then what purpose does it serve to incarcerate 1 to 3 theoretically productive members of society who tried to defend themselves or others? At the same time how do you let someone walk free given that their actions resulted in the death of another? Lots to find out still.

 

I think it really depends on the extent to which he was threatening people. Bystander testimony will be key. Seems like a huge fail by the subway police. Shouldn’t have taken 15 minutes to get there.

 

I agree that there are a lot of questions that need answered.

 

Unless NYPD officers are supposed to be camped out at every single subway location how is it a "huge" fail? What do you know about response times? Is this just another attempt at bashing the police?

Not that anyone deserves to be killed, but what is a guy with 40 arrests, and an existing warrant for battery, doing walking around with the rest of us?

 

I was placed in a chokehold by an acquaintance who had been bragging about his AF survival training at the academy (alcohol was involved). Within 10 seconds I had to tap out feeling like I was going unconscious. 3 minutes is manslaughter/homicide bordering on murder depending on the proficiency of the administrator.

a former MMA fighter did (Ortiz?) did this in New Orleans to a guy in a street fight and dropped him to the ground unconscious in what looked looked like 20 seconds.

Jail time is mandatory IMHO.

 

As others have stated, still too many unknowns to pass judgement. From what I've read, he was threatening people and acting in a very erratic way. But that's not terribly unusual to see in the subway given the amount of homelessness in NYC.

If that marine was physically threatened, or he was coming to the aid of someone who was directly threatened, I have no problem with him acting in self defense, intervening and subduing this guy until police arrived. Obviously, no civilian has any right to take anyone's life - regardless of this guy's priors. I agree with many who say he shouldn't have been on the streets to begin with with that rap sheet. But that's a different discussion. We can't have vigilante justice, you have to get the police involved, and that's what he should have done. This marine will pay the price for killing this guy.

 

All depends on facts. If it was a true chokehold for 3 minutes then jail is warranted regardless of initial intentions. If the guy didn't sink a proper choke in and Neely was still fighting then It at least opens things up for a different outcome. 3 people likely weren't restraining an unconscious person for 2 and a half minutes but then again.....we witnessed Derek Chauvin so I guess it's possible.

 

Dude its NYC. There are cops EVERYWHERE. Police are posted in most subway stops. He had this guy in a choke hold or headlock for 15 minutes. At one point the train arrived at a station, the doors opened and people got on and off, then the train left again.

 

This really is the problem. We don’t have a good way of dealing with mentally ill and drug addicted people in society.

 

That was Nate Diaz.

Yeah, most chokeouts I've seen over the years happen quickly. Maybe the man didn't know what he was doing and was trying to keep him subdued? Reportedly, one person who was there said they were very surprised to learn the guy had died and someone (maybe another person but not sure) said something suggesting the man had stopped applying pressure at some point - or at least they thought he had.

It would never occur to me that it'd be okay to apply and keep a choke hold on someone for several minutes. If that's what happened, as is being reported, I think he's in trouble.

 

Yeah. Diaz sunk a guillotine on that guy deep and clean with no resistance. Doubt this guy was able to land as clean a choke.

I was OK with Diaz subduing the guy because he was in his space but I also think he could have easily done it in a different way. I don't know enough about that case either but in the short video clip the guys hands were up and the guy seemed pretty ataxic from alcohol to be a legitimate threat short of having a weapon.

 

How many of those arrests are just this guy aggressively annoying someone or being visibly homeless in public?