Another shooting in Texas, 5 dead

so enlighten me, were are the illegal weapons coming from?

 

Added it already. Straw purchases, illegal secondary market purchases, and individual-level theft, often due to poor storage.

 

another scenario. i buy a gun legally, let it be known it can be bought from me fror2x the price. i leave it open in my house, you come and rob me, i report the gun stolen, is this the sellars fault that i am a crook pedaling illegal firearms, the dealer followed all the laws and rules when he sold it to me.

 

No, the gun dealer would have a bill of sale for the gun to the person who bought it. It would be the person who was trying to engage in illegal activity and who had the gun stolen as part of that (which seems relatively unlikely given that illegal businesses generally are pretty good at protecting their merchandise due to a lack of ability to rely on the state, but sure).

And we should probably keep a closer eye on people who seem to be buying guns for the purposes of re-sale (i.e., people who might be the last stage in the legal market for hundreds or thousands of guns). That is a feature not a bug of tracking.

 

if i can think of that scenario, since i have been told by many here i am dumb as a turnip, smarter people than me can come up with the idea, face it, you do not want to absolve the gun dealers if at all possible, it is their fault.

 

So we tighten our laws....all that does is stop the legal gun owners from getting guns....this guy was not legal, seems it didn't make too much difference what the gun laws were he got one anyway.

 

again, preaching to the choir

 

Sure, people think of robbing drug dealers, weapons dealers, human traffickers, etc. It is generally not a good idea given that they usually employ a lot of security who is more than willing to discourage this sort of behavior with a bullet to the head. Most people also think about that.

A number of gun dealers have engaged in "don't ask, don't tell" types of policies with obvious gun traffickers for years. However, again, the person responsible would be the last legal owner before it transfers into the illegal market. If that is their customer or their customer's customer, it would be wherever the legal paperwork stops. That is what tracking is about. Figuring out where guns drop out from the legal market.

 

Gotta love how those who value law and order for most any other issue are absolutely fervent in their claims that all laws do is punish good law abiding people.

Might as well get rid of DUIs, age limits, sex crimes, border wall etc etc. They don't stop people from committing those crimes anyway.....

 

Piece of cake to get an AR-15 in a country where they grow on trees.

 

but when people commit those crimes they are usually punished, in this case deported 5 times and still he came back, some punishment.like i said earlier, after time number 3 he should have been locked away.

 

Texas college baseball player struck by stray bullet during game | CNN

 

Sigh…that’s not the laws he was talking about. Being illegal in this country had nothing to do with him going on a rampage. Go back and check out the demographics of mass shooters if you think being in the US illegally vs legally actually played a role.

 

Well, considering we allow guns to be sold without background checks and we have more guns floating around than people in the country is it any wonder that someone can easily get their hands on a gun?

 

Most will agree with that. The issue is refusing to budge at all on more restrictive gun control, not bans. As someone else stated, buying, driving and maintaining a vehicle is more regulated than buying and maintaining guns. Doesn't mean people don't drive without a license, steal vehicles, drive drunk etc but imagine how many would if we didn't even try.

 

Here's a hypothetical scenario:

An undocumented immigrant who cannot legally purchase a gun hears gunshots coming from a neighbor's house. He immediately grabs the gun he had obtained illegally for self-defense and rushes to the scene. He finds that a heavily armed individual is attempting to commit a mass shooting in the neighborhood. Without hesitation, the undocumented immigrant confronts the shooter and uses his own gun to stop the massacre, saving numerous lives. Would the immigration status still be the hot issue for the pro gun contingent? I don't think so. I think we would be hearing about the benefits of a good guy with a gun.

This scenario highlights that the immigration status of a person does not necessarily determine their actions or ability to stop a violent act. I think it demonstrates why conflating the gun violence and immigration issues is not particularly helpful.

 

There is a business opportunity here.

Insurance.

States can require insurance for all gun owners with ammo / weapons purchase / private sale etc. Insurance premium for payouts to victims of any murder or shooting by insured owner with said insured gun.

A market of insurance would regulate the ability of someone to acquire a gun and ammo. The insurers would require a mental check, testing, etc.

Privatize the regulation with a business. The below idea from San Jose sounds promising… but they need to improve upon this.

Will Requiring Gun Owners to Buy Insurance Improve Firearm Safety?

 

Let's clarify. We do not allow guns to be sold by FFL's without background checks. That's a fact, so a blanket statement about guns being sold without background checks is not true. Now, are there ways, outside the purchase from an FFL, to obtain a firearm without a background check? Yes. But there are also laws already on the books regarding private sale, dealer sale, etc. Most of this depends on the current status of the individual.

 

You are focussing on technicalities of the law instead of addressing the larger issue of the ease of access to guns in the United States. While FFL's are required to perform background checks, the fact remains that there are still loopholes and ways for individuals to obtain guns without a background check. So I agree with @demosthenes assertion that we allow guns to be sold sans check.

 

Has your "good guy" been deported 4 times and re-entered illegally again? Either way, he has already broken the law. If we have laws, should we enforce them... yes or no?

And if it were me in your scenario, I would thank him for taking action, take his firearm or rifle, find out how he obtained it, and send him back to his country of origin with the stipulation that the next time he gets caught in the US, he will go to a federal prison for life with no chance for parole.