Florida woman forced to give birth to a baby that will die immediately

Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% of how you react. I'm guessing here that your friends have the same view of abortion as you? This was their experience and I think it was the best decision obviously, however, not everyone would react this way and nor should they. We have to allow that freedom for all.

Editing to add: I wonder what they would have done if the fetus had a condition that put the mother's life at risk.

 

argumentum ad passiones

 

Nice red herring.

Thankfully Ben did not have you making decisions for him.

 

Part of a certain sect of Christianity is the expectation and embrace of suffering. They want the rest of us to suffer too.

 

So religious wasn’t the best word. Should have said it is a largely a Christian viewpoint, and the more fundamentalist the most anti abortion they tend to be.

On the issue Jews see no be close to non affiliated, presumably because they don’t believe the Bible specifically addresses. So between Jews and non affiliated clearly when religion isn’t an influencing factor a large majority are pro choice.

Also non affiliated isn’t exactly the same as atheist or agnostic. It is possible that some of the 25% of pro life non affiliated may still identify generically as Christian.

This shows again that religion, specifically Christianity, is a primary driving factor of anti abortion movements. Do we have any other laws in the books that are primarily Christian belief based and are opposed by a majority of everybody else?

 

Outrage over the one baby forced to be born. Indifference over the millions that were never permitted to be born.

 

First, thank you for taking the time for a thoughtful response. I'm only quoting this part of your commentary to get your opinion on the matter related to the story in the OP.

In this particular case, we have a woman who is pregnant with a baby that has fatal abnormalities. For all intents and purposes, this woman considers this her child as most women do who are pregnant and look forward to meeting again post birth. However, given the condition of the baby, it will not be able to survive outside the womb (if it can make it that far). The baby's death is inevitable as we do not have the technology to cure the ailment (from what I read, the death could take place within minutes upon birth, but not likely to extend beyond hours). To anybody else reading this, if what I am not saying isn't factually correct, please feel free to jump in.

Would you find it acceptable for the state to prohibit an early termination of this pregnancy given these facts? Would you take issue with a doctor/hospital that would proceed with an abortion in this circumstance (feel free to answer separately for legally vs. morally if you have a difference of opinion there)? Are there any other mitigating factors that you would need to know before having an opinion on this?

Thanks.

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

 

Then there’s the whole “image of God” thing. We know Jesus for instance wasn’t white

 

Really thoughtful points here WES. Im not Plank, and I know this isnt a view of many in the pro-life camp, but I honestly allowances in cases like these being acts of compassion, both for the unborn soul and the mother.

I am actually sympathetic with both viewpoints here. The fact that a born baby is a human being regardless of physical condition and the act of preventing the painful events that the mother will suffer.

I dont see a clear cut approach from the Christian perspective as both can be viewed as compassionate approaches.

It isnt always black and white in my eyes.

 

Many people Christian included that misconceive that verbage.

Image of God is not a physical attribute.
The God of the Scriptures Isn't a bodily form.

I always shake my head at the Christian literalist that thinks God needs a set of physical eyes to see and physical ears to hear yet is described as being everywhere at all times in Scripture.

 

While I think your interpretation is more logical and practical and durable, I don’t know that is explicitly made clear in the Bible is it?

Plank is a a good example of how abortion really is about his religious beliefs.

 

I agree with most of this, but I don't see how state support for a prohibition of this nature isn't binary (at minimum, this specific case). You either want the state to take action to prohibit it or you do not want the state to take action to prohibit it.

Go GATORS!
,WESGATORS

 

Yet Jesus has always been depicted as a white guy…

 

What about the perspective of the Christian faiths that believe the state should not be involved in that decision, that it should be between the woman, her doctor and her faith? Are they "less" Christian in your view? The leaders of those churches are every bit as able to interpret the Bible as the anti-choice faiths. Are they wrong in your view?

 

I think I explained my stance when I compared this to euthanasia for someone who is terminally ill. Someone who is terminally ill needs care. This inconveniences and creates great difficulty for others. However, we don't prematurely induce death in such people because we know that is murder. It is the same thing. True religion is shown in caring for people like that. Caring for others when the cost is high is the litmus test for whether we are loving person or not.

My sister went through this, and she buried her son who did not even make it 2 days out of the womb. However, she cherished the days she carried her son in her womb. She celebrated his life. They went and did special things, so she could have memories to cherish with him when he was gone. She set it in her mind that she was going to love and cherish the son God gave her for the number of days that was given to her. She knew he was going to die to prematurely, but she was going to be the best mom she could possibly be. And she was a great mom to her son. Every baby should be loved like that.

Who are we to say his life wasn't precious and worth nurturing and celebrating? A person who is willing to say in their heart, "Your life does not have value. It is not worth nurturing and celebrating. I'm going to kill you"...that is pure evil. And that is exactly what is being advocated here. We shouldn't sugarcoat it. We should not bear false witness and call it loving or compassionate because it is not. We should speak of it as one of the most conceivably heinous acts that can be committed by a person. It should be shameful, and a person should be deadly afraid to meet God face to face if they have done something like that.

 

evolved communities do via assisted suicide (usually in the case of terminal illness). I guess that’s the one condition I have no problem with. Much better to go out on your own terms and saves the family from the horror of someone blowing their brains out.

 

Your opinion. And who is to say what worked for your sister is what everyone should go through? I know there are some who feel exactly like you and your sister in this situation. And they should have the choice to carry to term and enjoy whatever short life exists for the child. But there are others that if with the knowledge, the child will die within days, if not hours, carrying to term would be complete mental anguish. Who are you to say they shouldn't have a choice in the matter?

Sometimes killing is an act of compassion and not pure evil at all. We feel this way with the animals we love. Why shouldn't we allow people to make their own decisions around the care and compassion for others? Especially if forcing them to act one way may cause serious mental, if not physical harm? Couldn't that be considered evil too?

 

Not in scripture.
In scripture God is a spirit. Jesus (God in the flesh) was a jewish carpenter.

The white Jesus image is really created by white European artists who depicted Him in their image. These were the closest thing we had to photos, so ot evolved.

 

Less Christian? Not at all. In fact that is sort of what I am saying. Calling pro-life a purely religious position is countered by how many people of faith disagree with many portions of a pro life position.

 

Yep. Messiah was a Hebrew.