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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    And yet Trump is the one who authorized the lethal aid and training that was so crucial to bloodying Putin’s nose a year ago and preventing the quick win. If people are worried that Russia’s spring offensive is going to be successful, then just say that. Better yet, get loud about what actually needs to happen to defeat Russia instead of this half-ass, hope-as-a-strategy approach. Right now, it looks like this narrative (“If Russia wins, it’s still Trump’s fault”) is coming up again, like it did a year ago, as a preemptive excuse for the present administration’s failure to act decisively. If the President focuses on the win, he absolutely gets to take credit for the win. But what he doesn’t get to do is shift blame to Trump in the event of another strategic defeat. He owns it, win or loss.
     
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  2. Sohogator

    Sohogator GC Hall of Fame

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    Seriously, how did Russia keep its designation of a super power after the fall of the Berlin Wall? They’ve got the per capital GDP of Costa Rica., they’re probably about as mighty militarily as North Korea and flat out no good at war even when they out # defenders 10:1.



    It’s a total cluster. Putin has to be embarrassed.

    'Like turkeys at a shooting range': Mauling of Russian forces in Donetsk hotspot may signal problems to come | CNN


    The scenes are chaotic: Russian tanks veering wildly before exploding or driving straight into minefields, men running in every direction, some on fire, the bodies of soldiers caught in tank tracks.

    Russian military bloggers are calling it a fiasco, and worse.

    These scenes have been recorded by Ukrainian military drones over the past two weeks around the town of Vuhledar in Donetsk, eastern Ukraine, where successive Russian assaults have failed.
     
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  3. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    You can't fight for Ukraine! You hate their guts!
     
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  4. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I saw that. The town is like a fortress on a hill, and Russia sends up people and equipment in lines only to watch them get shot up and knocked down. The Russian bloggers are going insane watching that.

    What I am curious about is whether the mines that the tanks are running into were laid by Ukraine or Russia.
     
  5. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    I do hate Nazis!
     
  6. Gatorhead

    Gatorhead GC Hall of Fame

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    Wise council on your part, the late winter, spring offensive is building up (IMO), far to early to make assumptions, however my own hope is that Ukraine just holds on, gives up ground grudgingly, and launches a ferocious counter attack with the MBTs.

    They must husband these resources wisely of course, just because NATO is saying 300 - 400 tanks will be made available, does not mean committing a major blitzkrieg with those numbers.

    Considering the different MBT types and maintenance requirements, along with regular attrition, I suspect concentrating
    armor will be a challenge.

    It will be interesting to see how the Ukranians utilize it? Concentrated ala Heinz Gudarian or dispersed, ala the French model in 1940.

    Air support for protecting that armor, seems a prerequisite, and IMO is an inevitable conclusion NATO will come around to.

    F16s, Stryker's, Bradley's, Leopards......
    Not a bad package to put on the battlefield, along with our NATO allies various weapon systems.

    I bet mechanic's will be just as valuable as the front line soldiers given the hardware they have to operate.

    Putin may be a foreign policy master manipulator, but just as with Der Fuhrer in 1939 against Poland, Putin was not expecting the West to react. Now its not a declared war but in truth its a defacto one.

    Putin rolled over Georgia, Crimea and had success in orher parts of the globe, but his forces were not engaging professionally trained armies with Western hardware.

    Unless I am completely misguided, Israeli conflicts in the Middle East, resulted in devastating losses for Soviet or Russian Confederation supplied equipment.

    This played out twice for the USA vs Iraq, Soviet era hardware was non competitive.

    I'm hopeful a similar result will play out in Ukraine, starting now. We shall see.
     
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  7. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    How does the US hang on to superpower status when it got chased out of Afganistan by goat herders and is reduced to shooting down balloons ?
     
  8. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Yet you do seem to like Putin-Hitler. A lot.
     
  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Putin killing actual Nazis in Ukraine. Your Nazi card is hereby revoked.
     
  10. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    By having the most badass military on the planet, and having a functioning economy after walking away from Afghanistan. I wonder what happened to the Russian/Soviet economy after it heroically got chased out of Afghanistan by goat herders? (That's right--it collapsed. The goat herders not only defeated the Russian military, but reduced the economy of Russia to a flaming wreck. Who helped rebuild the Russian economy? That's right--the U.S. did.) Our military is so badass that when we shoot down balloons, communist leaders on the other side of the world crap their pants.
     
  11. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Putin could have killed more actual Nazis in his own military, if that was his actual objective. Your mentally disabled card is hereby glued to your forehead.
     
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  12. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Knocked back on ass in Korea. Defeated by rice patty farmers. Stealthiest aircraft ever produced shot down by ancient Serbian missiles. Defeated by Putin in Syria. Run out of Afghanistan. Cedes Iraq to Iran. Now watching it’s great proxy being crushed by Russia in spite of support from 40+ nations.
     
  13. Gatorhead

    Gatorhead GC Hall of Fame

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    I see a serious parallel.
     
  14. partdopy

    partdopy GC Hall of Fame

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    Good thing they haven't existed since the 1940s
     
  15. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  16. partdopy

    partdopy GC Hall of Fame

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  17. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Silly as it is, the rejoinder to “Nazis in Ukraine” is basically “Well, the Nazis lived during the 1940’s so no one can be a Nazi today!”
     
  18. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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