There is no way I'm wrong that it's happening. I've seen evidence of it with my own eyes and I've seen admissions of it from the horse's mouth, as though they're bragging about it. The question is to what extent it's happening. And we can discuss that all day, but I tend to think it's an incredibly common problem that is only going to get worse if it isn't addressed.
Right and that level of expertise means nothing I got it. F me for bringing it up lol but it’s you guys who won’t drop it now.
I didn't say it means "nothing," but it shouldn't conclusively end the conversation and prove that you're right. That's ridiculous.
You are certainly entitled to an opinion of course. But you’re like a guy studying an elephant with a microscope. You zoom in on this one spot, which is your limited experience, and pronounce this is what an elephant looks like even though you’ve never seen the whole elephant. And then some asshole like me comes along and says we’ll I’ve seen more of the elephant and it looks like this and you say screw you dude why should I believe you I know what I saw. How am I supposed to argue with that? Well I’ll keep posting links and articles but based on how this has gone you seem pretty inoculated to changing your mind and are just ignoring them.
My profession has been hospital recruiting and outside sales. Been doing it for different companies, including self-employment for 20 years. My expertise is in studying human behavior and interpersonal communications. In my experiences, know it all braggarts do not fare well in the private sectors. They may excel in academia.
I don’t know shit about hospital recruiting. If I argued with you about it and ignored your expertise that would be silly.
That’s great and I believe you. But if you made a point that didn’t jibe with my experience, I hope I wouldn’t pound my chest and argue incessantly over your point. I like to think I could learn something new from anyone.
I'm not saying the entire university is propagandizing this stuff. I'm not saying I got an equity lecture in Chemistry. That's not my point. My point is that there are certain departments and certain offices with certain initiatives created that spread these ideals onto students, then these students are placed on pedestals by these departments and offices so that they gain influence. That influence dramatically affects the culture, and the ideas spread like wildfire. And it really starts at an even earlier level than that, it's not like these values just start being brought up in college. They start in K-12. To stick to your analogy. It's more like I've seen a vital organ for the elephant. That vital organ is failing. I say the elephant is unhealthy based on the vital organ. You say it's healthy and as evidence to support that it's healthy, you show me all of the things that aren't wrong with the elephant. Doesn't change the fact that when the vital organ fails, the elephant probably dies.
Nah, I think it’s just that you realize your “point” was generally absent. While you accuse the other poster of one possible logical fallacy (appeal to authority), your own range of arguments in this thread is approaching a different type of “bad debaters” tactic, the old gishgallop. Gish Gallop: When People Try to Win Debates by Using Overwhelming Nonsense – Effectiviology The fact you refused to clarify a point and cut off my quotes when replying is revealing here.
I would say the culture is failing for the aforementioned reasons. If the culture is failing to the point of tremendous blind spots and creating this intellectual bubble, I would say that defeats the core purpose of higher education. It makes groupthink the norm in an environment where everyone is supposed to have their ideas challenged. So considering that this is severely harming the core purpose, I would say the vital organ is really the heart. Having competent and intelligent academics would be the brain and I don't think that's the issue.
OK bringing this discussion back to the state of florida and current happening. Florida is now recognized as one of the top states in higher education, if not the top depending on where you look. That rise to prominence took place simultaneously as DEI rise took place. Kendi was at UF as a professor 15-17 I think as an example, and the whole state spent more money on DEI after the FLoyd stuff. Even while all that was happening though, we still see tons of pieces like this: Why DEI initiatives are likely to fail (opinion) | Inside Higher Ed Why Diversity Initiatives Fail How Diversity Rhetoric Obscures Structural Inequities in Higher Education - here is one about how diversity efforts are actually hurting diversity! Broken Promises: Why Higher Ed Is Backtracking On Their DEI Commitments Despite Renewed Commitment to Diversity, Colleges Make Little Progress, Report Says And there is a lot more out there about this. What I would say is that many people know that DEI in higher ed is broken right now, not always tied to real action, effective policies, or meaningful goals - so change here is absolutely warranted. But I do think the idea that the movement has been hugely influential, on a system as huge and slow to change as higher ed - is a bit of a panic response by the right. But I will say - the big thing that worries me is Florida has achieved so much, as a state, in higher ed in the past few years, and to your analogy about a sick organ, all of our organs are healthy, but our doctor, the governor, is doing surgery on a healthy patient, when perhaps what would help is just an exam and maybe a suggestion to change our eating habits.
Dude but you are only talking about this ONE THING. There is a tremendous exchange of ideas on campus every single day. And you think this ONE THING is changing that?
This ONE THING is causing a chilling effect where people can't safely speak their mind without being ostracized as racist. And if you need more evidence that the term "racist" or "racism" is used recklessly, look no further than Ibram X. Kendi tethering racism to capitalism and look no further than inequality of outcome (something that is normal across throughout all free and prosperous cultures and countries) between races/genders being seen as explicit evidence of racism/sexism. You have mainstream civil rights lawyers saying a vote for DeSantis is a vote against Black people. You have the President of the United States saying if you don't vote for him, then you aren't Black. Then you wonder why conservatives keep their eyes open and their mouth shut when they go to college. It's not that they're this tiny minority of people. It's that there's a serious price to pay if you openly and publicly speak even mainstream conservative views.
