Hamper his mobility? When they weren’t kicking him in the head on the ground, They were standing him up so they could deliver more head shots! SMDH
One of the books I am reading now is The Earth is Weeping. Feels like a lot of parallels of these arguments. The U.S. Army is in the West trying to make it safe for westward expansion. To oversimplify far too greatly, there are some tribes of Indians still attacking settlers, but generally, the Army is the aggressor, and in quite a few instances wipes out a village, men, women and children, even if the tribe had signed a peace treaty and presented no threat, in some cases with documents that guarantee them safety if they show them to the Army. It didn't matter. After the Marias Massacre - Marias Massacre - Wikipedia Scout Joe Kipp recognized that the camp belonged to Heavy Runner, considered peaceful and not to be attacked per orders from Fort Shaw commander Colonel Philippe Régis de Trobriand. When told that the camp belonged to Heavy Runner, Baker responded, "That makes no difference, one band or another of them; they are all Piegans [Blackfeet] and we will attack them." Baker then ordered a sergeant to shoot Kipp if he tried to warn the sleeping camp of Blackfeet and gave the command to attack.[15] Kipp shouted to try to prevent the attack, and Baker placed him under arrest. Frances Densmore at a recording session with Blackfoot chief, Mountain Chief, in 1916 The noise alerted the Piegan camp and Chief Heavy Runner. Heavy Runner ran toward the soldiers, "shouting and waving a piece of paper—a safe conduct from the Indian Bureau."[2] He was immediately shot and killed. Scout Joseph Cobell later took credit for shooting Heavy Runner. Cobell was married to the sister of Mountain Chief and wanted to divert attention from his brother-in-law's camp, which he knew was about 10 miles (16 km) downstream. After Cobell's first shot, the rest of Baker's command opened fire.[2] From the ridges above the camp, the soldiers shot into lodges filled with sleeping people. After a while, they charged into the camp. William Birth of Company K boasted that they sliced open lodge coverings with butcher knives and shot the unarmed people inside. He said: "We killed some with axes" and "gave them an awful massacreing. [sic]"[14] Some of the aftermath is covered in the Wikipedia piece, but it's eerily similar to today. Many in the East were outraged at the grotesque behavior and demanded something be done, whereas Western settlers felt like they were just savages, that all Indians were the same, and it didn't matter. Pair that with Army claims that those back east just didn't understand their situation. It's obviously more complex than that; I'm oversimplifying. But I was reading that last night after reading this thread yesterday and it sounded so similar
Another specialty unit, the Wilmington Field Force, blatantly lies about about the law to try to get a driver that is also a lawyer not to film
I like that you remember it & with such accuracy. I've recounted stories in detail from back in the day only to get completely blank looks. It's makes me feel lonely.
Please tell me you've researched enough to understand WHY they lowered hiring standards. Memphis Police Department was down over 500 officers. This article was from June of 2022. The situation got worse, despite $15,000 signing bonuses, retention incentives and $5000 referral bonuses. MPD makes adjustment to handle staff shortages So what do you do when you need more officers and financial incentives aren't working? They couldn't pretend Memphis wasn't in Tennessee, so that pretty much leaves lowering hiring standards.
You think no one wants to be a cop in Memphis because it is in Tennessee? And I didn’t argue that there were not reasons for it. But and it’s a HUGE butt… when you lower your standards you get lower quality people. When you get lower quality people you get lower quality work. And here we are.
If they lowered their standards and were considered low quality cops to fill jobs, how did these guys end up in a special task force with more training than regular beat cops?
4 of the five had multiple reprimands and issues on the job prior to this. How they ended up on the special task force.. I don’t know. The chief has also had issues when in Atlanta prior to moving to Memphis . When you lower expectations you get lower quality work. In any school, in any job, in any profession. Why would any decent upstanding citizen want to be a cop? It’s a no win situation. A job with tons of downside and no upside. No respect. Low pay. Dangerous, mentally exhausting, and often targeted and degraded. So we get the what we have in this case.
What bothers me is the thought that a class or two can turn someone into a good caring person. It only provides guidelines on what you can and cannot legally do. Many situations cannot be duplicated in a classroom. My opinion is cops that beat people indiscriminately were made that way growing up. It’s difficult to know what’s in their hearts and minds from a few tests and some basic training. When I was in the police academy I was able to identify the students who were aggressive from their actions during training and testing. They had already been hired by their respective agencies. If a dogs going to bite it will do it as a puppy. Aggressive and prejudiced people will continue to be those types.
To this point, why do people seem to expect that handing a better/more educated applicant a badge, gun, insert them into a wagons circled/thin blue line cop culture and give them virtual immunity to act violently wont turn them into thugs like the other "poor hire" guys? Serious question - is a psyche evaluation something PDs do when hiring people?
When I worked with the SO ( in a reserve capacity) I was approached by the head of the reserves about a candidate. I was a full time fire/arson investigator with Tampa Fire. There are two levels of reserve officers with very important differences. 1. Regular reserves. Fully trained and certified. Able to work alone like a regular deputy. I was member of this group to keep my police certification current. 2. Auxiliary deputies that had minimal training and could only work with a fully certified deputy within their span of control. At one time while working as an arson investigator with Tampa Fire a buddy who was in charge of hiring reserve deputies calls me and asks me about a paramedic at Tampa Fire that wants to join the regular reserves. Just happened to be a good friend of mine and as good a paramedic as I’ve witnessed. There was one problem. He was a loose cannon when off duty. Did some stupid stuff that any sane person would say WTF about. Didn’t hurt anyone or break any laws. I told my buddy about him and what I personally witnessed and ended it with,,, absolutely do not hire the guy, he’s a good guy but a loose cannon. To this day he doesn’t know I’m the one who blocked his hiring. I asked my buddy doing the hiring to please don’t let him know since we are friends. I wish it were that easy and obvious when hiring LEOs.
Are you blaming the action of these bad cops on the police department environment? If that was the case wouldn’t it be rampant across the department and not isolate individuals? I agree classes and training can’t change a persons heart. I’ll also argue that there are far more good people in the PD in general than there are bad. The bad get the spotlight. The bad get the press. And everyone else gets branded and stereotyped. We revolt against doing that to other groups. But not to cops.
Yes a psyche evaluation was done by both the agencies I worked at. I’d imagine it’s done at all. At least I hope. I’ve witnessed good cops not get into the pack mode and do what other bad cops do. They are out there. There will always be those that do what bad cops do especially those trained by bad cops. Thinking about the 5 guys that beat the man to death. Do you think they just acquired the taste of brutality? I’d bet they already were that way prior to being hired.
Seems like Memphis blamed the environment, at least in the SCORPION unit. They shut the whole unit down, rather than say it was a few bad cops discrediting everyone else. I think the worst abuses tend to happen in these special units, like the Gun Trace Task Force in Baltimore, or some of the police gangs in LA. Lots of those units operate no different from criminal organizations to be honest. They become tribal and often have their own cultures which can be even more toxic than regular police. But that seems to be the trend in policing and military culture, the turn to JSOC style "operator" culture and special forces - counter-insurgency stuff. Of course the military has the same problem with them too, those guys become criminals doing sex and drug trafficking when they get bored.
Funny how so many here want "equity" well I'm guessing places like Memphis has it. What were the qualifications of these officers? Were they vetted? Were they on the force due to skin color or affirmative action? Has anything been said about this? And since these "cops" were all black instead of white, now the emphasis is on the victim. I just find it amazing that every "story" posted online is primarily about someone who is black. Actually, not amazed since it feeds into a narrative. Are there no instances where whites aren't treated unfairly or have died in a similar instance? Lastly, I feel for this family, in no way, shape or form should this young man have died. It was abhorrent and justice will be served. And the truth of the matter, All lives matter.
Its possible, if you enter a more permissive environment, you can definitely indulge in behaviors you might not otherwise engage in given the possibility of consequences. But there are plenty of sociological experiments where normal people can be goaded into visiting cruelty onto others too. You can turn normal people into violent maniacs too with the right social pressures.
I have a small issue with blaming culture.. any culture. Culture cannot be held accountable for any actions taken. Individuals can be held accountable. So while I see culture in PDs across America as an issue that needs to be addressed I do not see it as something that can be blamed for the actions of an individual. Once we start doing that … in May arena.. we lose all responsibility or ability to hold anyone/anything accountable. These five acted. They made a decision. They made choices. It wasn’t he culture that made those decisions or hose choices. It was individuals.
Yes it was individuals, individuals who were strongly influenced by a culture, in the case of five officers who at beat and killed Tyre Nichols it was the culture not just of the police department but more so of the SCORPION unit which dehumanized Nichols by casting him as the enemy.
