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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. ajoseph

    ajoseph Premium Member

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    The battle plan/sequence sounds straight from a Tom Clancy novel based on a fictional war with China. What I didn’t consider is your second paragraph. The logistics of protecting the aircraft on the ground and maintaining the aircraft. Really informative and thanks!!
     
  2. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    What exactly do you think we are doing regarding vassal states? Putting the boot on their necks stating we own you. Nothing more than an American state by proxy. What's more if you don't like it we can take your government out just as easily as we put it in and replace it with someone who will bend the knee.

    Now we get to the point of contention and why our moral stance is seriously flawed. Russia will take parts of Ukraine in my opinion that is a foregone conclusion. The question is how much of Ukraine will they take? When Russia takes over they will implement their own government and become a full fledged territory that belongs to Russia. No proxy involved. Why is it easy enough for Russia to do this? Ukrainians have been under Russian rule before and people of Ukraine have a Russian culture of language and history that goes back for centuries. Do you think for one minute the passage of Ukrainian law to remove the Russian language from Ukraine is going to stop that? This is not going to happen without Ukraine purging all Russians which is highly doubtful.

    I will grant you this we did not take Iraq when we certainly could have. Big mistake. As for Afghanistan we never had a significant foothold in that nation to do so.
     
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  3. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    sanctions hitting home as Russian airlines are having to cannibalize their commercial fleet for parts

    Russian Regulator Approves Aircraft Cannibalization Amid Sanctions | Aviation Week Network

    Russian authorities have again adjusted the domestic continuing airworthiness procedures to help operators cope with sanctions.

    The Federal Air Transport Agency (Rosaviatsia) has formally given approval to aircraft cannibalization, meaning that parts from grounded airframes can be re-installed on in-service aircraft.

    The legislative amendments were approved Dec. 26, 2022, although the provisions related directly to cannibalization remain classified. Citing sources from Russian airlines, Moscow-based newspaper Izvestia reported that a part taken from a grounded aircraft should be tested in order to receive airworthiness approval tags, and then tested again after being installed on a different aircraft.

    The legislative amendments were approved Dec. 26, 2022, although the provisions related directly to cannibalization remain classified. Citing sources from Russian airlines, Moscow-based newspaper Izvestia reported that a part taken from a grounded aircraft should be tested in order to receive airworthiness approval tags, and then tested again after being installed on a different aircraft.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  4. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    The goal of any war is to win which means eliminating leadership. Without an Army at the ready to move into Kyiv the move on Putin's part was to disorient the government. Someone else would have stepped into Zelensky's shoes most likely a military figure and continued with the resistance. Make no mistake Zelensky has a successor waiting in the wings exactly who that is certainly up for debate. Not to have one would certainly be irresponsible and would speak ill of his intentions concerning the Ukrainian people. The I am supreme and I am the only one who can save you mentality is myopic.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
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  5. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    I highly doubt those negotiations would have included all of Ukraine. Removing Zelensky off the board does nothing more than move second in charge to the head of the line. In the same vein removing Putin off the broad is no guarantee the war will end either.
     
  6. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    You've heard them time after time in this discussion and your assessment of a petulant child is exactly why we are in the position we are in.
     
  7. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    Time will tell but from my perspective things are not falling apart for Putin but they certainly appear to be falling apart for Zelinsky. The major shake up in the Ukrainian government and the corruption of Ukrainian statesmen highlight that fact. They are more concerned about their own well being than they are for the Ukrainian people. Crap hits the fan they leave the country with their ill gotten gains and leave everyone else to fend for themselves. As the regime takes over what makes you think they will not do the same? The corruption runs deeper than those at the top of the food chain.
     
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  8. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    And who is waiting in the wings to take over for Zelensky? Where was the massive invasion of troops to take over Kyiv once the dirty deed was done? There was nothing but a handful of troops to carry out the deed. Removing Zelensky is not enough you have to take all of Kyiv to solidify the take over. This fact seems to be lost on people but it is not lost on those that intend to topple a government.
     
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  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Remember that it was the expressed goal of US/NATO to bring Russia to its knees via sanctions and isolate it from the larger world.

    By that metric alone the war has been a spectacular, repeat: SPECTACULAR failure.
     
  10. ajoseph

    ajoseph Premium Member

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    Yes, there is most certainly a successor plan for Zelensky. But there is also a difference in leaders. Zelensky has proven himself to be a great leader, motivator and statesman. It is highly doubtful the successor would carry such gravitas. Putin wants to install a puppet so that he has de facto control over all of Ukraine.
     
  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    And Putin is not going to stop there! This time next year we’ll all be speaking Russian!!!
     
  12. PITBOSS

    PITBOSS GC Hall of Fame

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    potd. specific men/women had a massive impact (both positive and negative) during critical periods of world history.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
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  13. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    I'm didn't say Zelensky is not unimportant. For a comedian to step into the shoes of leading a nation there is no doubt in my mind everyone had second thoughts about his leadership. What I made clear is that there are others that will step into his shoes. Whether or not they are as effective as Zelensky is different question. No one knows what lurks in the minds of successors or how they would perform until they actually take power. You can make all the assumptions you want based on current performance but you will never know. A comedian to a charismatic leader with no experience in government or international affairs. I'd say we have been down that road quite a few times in history.

    As for Putin wanting to install a puppet the sad reality is Ukraine is the ping pong ball when it comes to the west wanting to install their puppet as well.
     
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  14. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

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    The U.S. offered to evacuate Zelensky at the start of the war, he refused. Zelensky appears to be the real deal, which of course is why the Russian gangster state wants to assassinate him.

    It seems bizarre you don’t comprehend the root of most of this “institutional” corruption you are referring to in Ukraine, and nobody doubts its existence, is actually driven by Russia. Some of the former U.S.S.R satellite states broke away and are doing well. Some are basically corrupt vassal states with only illusory sovereignty (govt totally subservient to Putin). Ukraine is currently a front-line. They tossed the Russian influence and are trying to break free, literally fighting for their freedom and sovereignty from Russia. It’s like you think if Russia can corrupt a nation enough, it’s theirs for the taking, because they were corrupt anyway. It’s a circular logic with a very poor endgame for the “free” world.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
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  15. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    The country that Ukraine needed to break free of is the US. Ukraine is neither sovereign nor democrat. All it is is a crash test dummy.
     
  16. coleg

    coleg GC Hall of Fame

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    And we're all surprised you remain here Comrade. LOL
     
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  17. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    I said I was leaving the Coronavirus thread, Topknot.
     
  18. PITBOSS

    PITBOSS GC Hall of Fame

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    No please don’t leave that. They still need your insights and “theories”.
     
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  19. uftaipan

    uftaipan GC Hall of Fame

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    Unfortunately, until the war is long over, we probably won’t understand the economic impact of the sanctions. We want them to be working, so naturally we will bite off on data that supports our desires and overlook anything that does not. It is difficult for us to take into account measures Russia would take to alleviate and/or hide the effect of sanctions. During WW2, for instance, we dramatically overestimated the effect of passive and active measures (bombing) against the German economy and didn’t learn a sense of the true impact until during the post-war investigation. That is not to say we should not hold firm on sanctions or even increase them, only that we should manage expectations relative to our military measures, which are far more concrete.
     
  20. carpeveritas

    carpeveritas GC Hall of Fame

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    Are you suggesting that not a single Ukrainian participated in the corruption? Did I say Zelensky isn't the real deal? The fact that Zelensky chose to remain in Ukraine doesn't change the ending result of where we are today. Surely you are not suggesting that if Zelensky had chosen to accept the US offer this war would have never occurred.

    All heads of state live with the possibility of assassination attempts and their potential demise. This is nothing new. Even on this board people were calling for Putin's head on a platter yet both of these men remain in power. Either the security is unbelievable or people are not upset to the point to initiate such a change in leadership.

    On the subject of corruption. Who corrupted these people in the first place? First and foremost these people have to be willing and acceptable to acts of corruption. To suggest Russia is the only offending nation capable of corrupting governments is myopic. The US is just as complicit as is China, Russia and the UK or any other number of governments.