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  1. Hi there... Can you please quickly check to make sure your email address is up to date here? Just in case we need to reach out to you or you lose your password. Muchero thanks!

Update: Alec Baldwin case dismissed

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by WarDamnGator, Jan 19, 2023.

  1. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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  2. defensewinschampionships

    defensewinschampionships GC Hall of Fame

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    Not sure about the legal terms here, but he was certainly negligent and that caused a person to die. If the story as written is true.
     
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  3. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

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    Seems crazy to me he is held responsible for this.
     
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  4. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

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    I haven't read the story. How was he negligent? Was it his responsibility to check for a live round?
     
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  5. DesertGator

    DesertGator VIP Member

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    One should ALWAYS check a firearm to make sure whether or not it's loaded.
     
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  6. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

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    Involuntary manslaughter seems entirely appropriate, if not obvious. I view this similar to police shootings, if you do a bad shoot you don’t get to just say “oops, my bad”. If incompetence is at play, there should be a form of criminal negligence. That obviously doesn’t mean every death or accident becomes criminal, but where clear negligence can be shown…

    It may seem more obvious for the armorer to be responsible than Baldwin, but if he put an incompetent person in charge then you could argue he is the more responsible party.
     
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  7. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

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    I think what came out is the armorer was pretty much incompetent or hired due to nepotism, and as producer Baldwin “should have known” that.

    Whether they can convict him pretty much depends on if they can prove he knew there were issues with the armorer. I’m guessing to charge him, they found some stuff like complaints/emails about her incompetence.
     
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  8. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

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    To echo what desert stated above, every weapon must be regarded as being loaded.
     
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  9. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

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    Ahhh. Didn't realize he was producer.
     
  10. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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    I think it's a combination of the him being a producer, and there already have been a number of complaints and "misfires" (to the point that few crew members left the set out of fear for their safety), him being a producer who should have had more control of the set, and him being the one who pulled the trigger. I suspected he'd get charged with something equivalent to 'negligence resulting in death', not sure if involuntary manslaughter is the same as that ...

    I still believe the person actually responsible for the death is the person who brought a live round to the movie set, and I suspect that's the armorer ...
     
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  11. GCNumber7

    GCNumber7 VIP Member

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    I still don’t understand why live rounds are even allowed on any set given this isn’t the first time this happens.
     
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  12. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

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    I know nothing about guns. What does a blank look like in a gun vs a live round?
     
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  13. DesertGator

    DesertGator VIP Member

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    No actual projectile in the brass. Here's an example. It's pretty easy to tell by visual inspection, but you have to eject the round to know for sure.

    [​IMG]
     
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  14. orangeblue_coop

    orangeblue_coop GC Hall of Fame

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    With death (especially one that could've easily been prevented) comes accountability.
     
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  15. tampagtr

    tampagtr VIP Member

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    Colin Miller does what one should really do if the issue is the validity of the decision to charge. He looked at the NM statute and the case law for the elements of the crime. Thread

     
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  16. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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    One complication here is that for movies, for the sake of realism on close ups, they use real bullets that have been altered to be inert. I remember reading this from the old thread, but the armorer is supposed to take a real bullet, remove the bullet, remove the gun powder, press the bullet back in place, and then drill a hole in the side to mark it as an inert round. I suspect what happened here is the armorer either missed a bullet when she was dummying them up, or somehow mixed real and dummy bullets... and that's how a real bullet got brought to the set.

    There is supposed to be a person the set who inspects the gun and checks there are holes drilled in the casings of all the bullets before each close up scene. This was obviously not done.

    It was a complete failure of gun protocol on the set.
     
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  17. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

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    Yeah I'm not sure how you hold an actor responsible for that. Producer? Sure.

    Unfortunately for Baldwin, he's both.
     
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  18. DesertGator

    DesertGator VIP Member

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    Didn't realize they went through that kind of process on sets.
     
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  19. WarDamnGator

    WarDamnGator GC Hall of Fame

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    Here is a quote from an old NYT story on it. They apparently opened the gun before the police arrived, and realized one of the bullets in the gun didn't have the drilled hole...

    "After the shooting, Mr. Halls said, he picked up the gun from a pew inside the church and took it to Ms. Gutierrez-Reed. When she opened it, he said, according to the affidavit, he could see “at least four dummy casings with the holes on the side, and one without the hole. He advised this did not have the cap on it and was just the casing.” Dummy rounds are sometimes identified by a pierced hole on the side."
     
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  20. Bazza

    Bazza GC Hall of Fame

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    I predict both will plea down to a lesser charge. Hope the movie gets finished....