Meet the Pensacola English teacher waging war on books

It's not about changing people's attraction, it's about molding the minds of children as to what is moral and acceptable.

I was comparing the traditional view of a gay relationship with premarital sex, which is similar. Both are rampant in America, both are considered sinful under strict Christian standards of morality. Do I have a personal problem with either? No. Do I think it's fair to demonize or ostracize anyone who does on a personal or religious level? No.

Animals can't marry, but I think that whole argument kind of goes out the window when we're talking about children's books with talking animals. In stories like that, they can talk, they can reason, they have a sense of right and wrong, etc. They're really people disguised as animals for purposes of a children's story. Jiminy isn't really a cricket. Also, people are held to a higher standard than animals. A male dog goes around chasing every female he can find, a human man does that, he probably gets in more than a little trouble.

 

Comparing books depicting homosexual couples to a historical book, like a biography, regarding a U.S. President is just ridiculous.

Because it's not the role of the school to push controversial stances on morality on children. And offering books that normalize these things to children is a form of tacit endorsement.

I've also said that I'm fine with the books being available in high school and maybe middle school in the very post you quoted.

 

If you believe all that then there is no reason age-appropriate books like the one about the penguin daddies shouldn't be in an elementary school library. And if there are books in the library about families with a father and a mother in the story there is no reason there can't be books about families with 2 mothers in the story.

 

You are routinely mischaracterizing what I'm saying. I have no issue with gay people "existing" or being represented in elementary school libraries. It's the specifics of their homosexual relationships even with euphemisms like "love is love," that is the problem.

Just curious. Where do you draw the line? Is everything short of pornography and profanity fair game in a children's library to you?

Me, I'm fine with FDR books being in children's libraries and I'm fine with Reagan books being in children's libraries. Books glamorizing transgender identity and homosexual relationships is a different story. If that means no mention of heterosexual couples either, so be it. I think I'm being more than fair and certainly a Hell of a lot fairer than you.

 

Why don't you show me where EXACTLY to avoid any confusion.

Yes, because it's that latter part being sold as normal or morally acceptable to children in public school that I have a problem with.

 

This post offers the legal standard as to what would be breaching of the First Amendment, not what books are fair game as to "what should be" removed on the part of schools and school boards. So unless you're saying all books permitted under the First Amendment should be available in elementary school libraries, no you didn't tell me where exactly you draw the line. You gave me a legal standard under the First Amendment creating a framework for the process for removing books, you didn't tell me ANYTHING about which books should be removed. So no, you didn't answer "where you draw the line."

Here's the problem, I agree with them, and I would allow them at high school levels and perhaps middle school levels. That kind of suggests it's about age and not about ideas, especially considering that the counterexample you provided was a Reagan book. I was exposed to FDR books in elementary school and that is completely fine. I was exposed to civil rights books in elementary school and that is completely fine.

 

I'm asking you where YOU would do it. Then you're dodging by saying "you'll leave it to the experts."

The Kama Sutra has a lot of "ideas" in there as well, though I don't think it's appropriate for children's libraries to have in stock.

I'm also curious where you draw the line on this particular issue as well, if a children's book normalizes polyamory, would that be okay to you?

 

Should all books about Jewish people be banned from school libraries considering the fact that there are approximately three times as many gay people than Jewish people in the United States?

 

It's funny how you and the "experts" always seem to draw lines in identical places. Makes you think about the politics of the "experts."

I don't favor any form of erotic texts being available to children.

I used that to point out not all "ideas" are "age appropriate," which seems to be something you agree with. You just think depiction of homosexual couples is, and I don't. I'm asking you for further clarity as to what you consider not age appropriate and all you do is keep giving me a variant of "don't look at me, I don't make the decisions."

And what if it highlights the polygamy and frames it as normal?

 

So you do disagree with the experts sometimes on decisions within their discretion.

It sounds to me like removal of books in elementary schools to you fall in one of three categories:
1. Decisions you agree with: Good decisions by the school board which are beneficial to the kids.
2. Decisions you disagree with: Orwellian book bans echoing that of the Nazis.
3. Illegal removal of books: Breach of the First Amendment.

Because I'd be hard-pressed to find a single person under any reasonable set of moral standards, whether gay or straight that oppose heterosexual marriage. But if that's what it takes to enforce removal of books containing homosexual marriage or relationships, so be it. I'd be willing to do that in the interest of the law and of fairness. Yet, I'm getting treated all the same to you as if I wouldn't have offered removal of books containing heterosexual relationships. You're not giving much incentive for anyone making any concessions to you. I'm sensing a lot of "it's my way or you're an intolerant bigot who likes burning books."

If it glamorizes those relationships, would that be a problem? My Lord, this is like pulling teeth with you.

 

Classic example of the kind of book that shouldn't be available in public school children's libraries, let alone an age group between 3 and 5-6.

 

there is a reason that Jewish tradition is matriarchal. You always know who a kids mother is.

 

yeah but you aren’t opposed to just books glamorizing it. You are opposed to books normalizing it. That is where you are in the wrong.

 

So glamorizing it is bad, normalizing it is fine, and the only difference between you and me is where we draw the line?