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War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    If I can just tighten up on my grammar I could push Russia over the top!
     
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  2. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Pentagon is considering crossing a red line with Russia: supplying long-range missiles.

    Pentagon now more likely to support Ukrainian long-range missile attacks on Russia, The Times reports

    Sounds like Biden recalled a time when an administration that he was a part of issued an ultimatum to a leader of another country, and they laughed at it and ignored it, and they got away with crossing the red line. Therefore, crossing a red line = no consequences. Hope he knows what he's doing.
     
  3. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    For months now, with no small help from the US, Ukraine has been striking targets inside Russia.

    But Putin is an unhinged madman.
     
  4. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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  5. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    The fire is already rapidly spreading. From a Siberian tire factory to a large Russian barracks in Crimea, with several people killed. Dumpster transportation companies are under investigation.

    Casualties reported in large-scale fire incident in occupied Crimea

    I remember the days when the Russian army was considered so competent and capable that they would not set their own barracks on fire.
     
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  6. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    If Putin strikes targets inside of Ukraine, why wouldn't Ukraine strike targets inside of Russia? Does one side get to set the rules for the conflict as far as what geographic areas are off-limits?

    Speaking of rules, Ukraine is obeying the rules of armed conflict by attacking Russian military targets. Russia is violating the rules of armed conflict by targeting civilians, schools, hospitals, power plants, and apartments, as well as operating torture centers. The Russian army is a veritable fountain of atrocities and war crimes.

    When I choose a madman, I like to choose the one that doesn't understand the rules for acceptable behavior. That would be Putin.
     
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  7. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    The U.S. is sending two dozen A-10 Warthogs to the boneyard. Ukraine didn't want them because they could not be protected from Russian aircraft or anti-aircraft defenses.

    21 Avenger Salute: Congress Sentences a Batch of A-10s to the Boneyard for the First Time in Decades

    I think they should try a few of them to see what happens. The plane can take a beating, and might be o.k. with other fighter jets in the sky to protect it.
     
  8. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I think Clausewitz was talking about destroying the other side's army, not your own. Certainly not to the point where you have to draft 300,000 people who have never held a firearm and hope that they can hold off one the world's more capable armies with no more than a rusty rifle and a week's worth of training on how to dig a ditch. On the plus side, Putin and his generals certainly have destroyed an army in Ukraine--just not the right one.
     
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  9. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    D’uh! That’s what I just said. War is war. And if it was me I’d never complain about strikes inside my own country.

    The point I’m making is that, when these strikes occur, even when the Russian public screams for blood ... Russia continues to proceed business as usual.

    It belies the notion of Putin as an unhinged madman. If anything, he leaves himself exposed to the notion of being overly cautious.
     
  10. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    And we’ve already dispensed with the notion of Russia having anything worse than light casualties compared to the casualties it’s inflicting. Take Bakhmut ...

    Ukraine has said that it is outgunned by Russia 9:1 in the city. And no, Russia is not attacking frontlines in “human waves” WWI style.

    Russia is not fighting in a way as to expose it to high casualties. Ukraine is.
     
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  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Any planes the US cares to send are no match for Russian AA. Indeed, given AA, ALL aircraft are vulnerable these days. Including Russian aircraft.

    The days of manned aircraft, flying casually over war zone is likely drawing to an end.
     
  12. slayerxing

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    lol what more can he escalate? They’re already bombing civilian targets. Lol restrained. Meanwhile he just keeps throwing conscripts in the grinder.
     
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  13. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Restrained in a way that the West is not. See: Siege of Mosul.

    In other words, the reason the US is likely green lighting strikes inside Russia is that it has little fear that Russia will retaliate by purposefully bombarding civilians.

    It must gall yahoos to have to acknowledge that Russia cares more about civilians than the US does.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2022
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  14. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    Sad, pathetic, true ...

    It is important to grasp that the role of the U.S. military has become largely theatrical. The 20-year disaster in Afghanistan was like the extended run of a Broadway show, a reliable crowd-pleaser generating satisfying tales of courageous troops defending isolated outposts against the Taliban hordes. Casualties were light and the war coverage and movies were satisfying.

    The Ukraine proxy war is similarly satisfying to the propaganda-conditioned American public. Evil Russians are dying at the hands of courageous Ukrainians armed by American high-tech wunder-waffen. Our brilliant generals are guiding Ukraine's efficient defense against the Russian hordes. Casualties are light and the war coverage is entertaining.

    Until large numbers of U.S. troops die in a military disaster or a U.S. city gets destroyed, this theater of cruelty will continue, with the chants of USA! USA! drowning out the voices of sanity.
     
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  15. slayerxing

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    The notion that Russia has light losses is laughable. Pentagon recently estimated over 100k casualties and climbing and 8000 pieces of equipment lost. It’s been a disaster for the Russian military. Sadly Ukraine has also lost over 100k. Just a sad unnecessary humanitarian disaster.
     
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  16. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    I’ve tried to calmly explain why this is a wild exaggeration. But you are marinated in propaganda.

    Remember, LYING has always been the stock-and-trade of the CIA. And the media is almost wholly steered by CIA directives.

    Another crack in the iron curtain (we’re the iron curtain these days, we’re the old Soviet Union) is Meduza’s Russian casualty report.

    Meduza is a Latvia-based and virulently anti-Russia organization.

    It has recently estimated 9,311 Russian deaths since the beginning of the conflict. And of this total, slightly more than half are Russian contract troops, the remainder being volunteers.
     
  17. duggers_dad

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    On the other hand ...

     
  18. slayerxing

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    There are services that have geo located and confirmed Russian losses that Russia still denies. I know you think somehow you and you alone have avoided the propaganda but… it’s just not true. Sorry bud.
     
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  19. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

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    There are no such services that have confirmed vast numbers of Russian casualties. At some point, common sense has to take hold. You’re falling for outlandish bromides that have nearly the entirety of the Russian army being eliminated when Kyiv acknowledges it’s been vastly outgunned from the beginning.
     
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  20. slayerxing

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    a legit supply issue because of policy…


    Under U.S. law, the Pentagon’s top military officer, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Gen. Mark Milley, is required to regularly submit munitions requirements to Congress for each war plan on the agency’s books, known in Pentagon parlance as operational plans (or OPLANs). Most of the munitions that the United States is giving to Ukraine—such as NATO-standard 155mm artillery and multiple launch rockets, for instance—are earmarked for fighting Russia or North Korea.

    But the lack of changes to the plans since Russia’s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in February has frustrated lawmakers and aides, who have called for more of the weapons put aside for a hypothetical fight with Russia to be sent to Ukraine, which is actually fighting Russia now. As the pace of U.S. military aid to Ukraine has slipped since the summer, concern on Capitol Hill is that the United States is holding back weapons for a Europe-wide conflict that Russia may not be prepared to fight, when Ukrainian troops are already degrading the Russian military on the battlefield.

    “The OPLAN versus Russia is the same one it’s been for the last decade,” said a second congressional aide familiar with the debate, speaking on condition of anonymity to describe behind-the-scenes discussions. “We haven’t adjusted that based on the fact that the Ukrainians have essentially neutered the Russian army. So we have a plan in place to deal with the Russian army as we thought it was a year or two years ago.”

    foreignpolicy.com/...
     
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