Welcome home, fellow Gator.

The Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

War in Ukraine

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by PITBOSS, Jan 21, 2022.

  1. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    Ukraine is throwing everything into the meat grinder that is Bakhmut. And Western media, seems to be taking notice.

    If Ukraine retreats, then Russia breaks one of the last lines of defense in the Donbass. After Bakhmut there is Kramatorsk and Slavyansk, and once those fall, it is free and easy driving all the way to the Dniepr.

    However, the only way Ukraine can hold Bakhmut is by sacrificing thousands of troops, indefinitely, on a regular basis.

    Either Ukraine retreats to the last line of defense, or it keeps losing thousands of soldiers every week.

    It is still not evident that Russia is interested in anything other than continuing to chew through the human strength of the Ukrainian military.
     
  2. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
    No one who is actually paying attention thinks that Bakhmut is the last line of defense in this area. Russia Mil-bloggers said the same thing about Severodonetsk months and months ago and look where we are today.

    Also - for those paying close attention - Bakhmut has a river going through it and Ukraine controls the high ground on the other side of the river - so it's not like the town is just going to fall immediately anyways even if Russia actually even makes it to the river, which they have yet to do, ever in MONTHS of fighting.

    And all reports are Russia is losing just as many if not more troops there every single day - of course they have the advantage of more meat for the grinder ultimately.

    Finally - and this is big - there is a huge contact line between Russia and Ukraine. The idea that the whole Ukrainian line falters because of BAKHMUT is hilarious. Ukraine could lose Bakhmut and still advance in other areas, especially around svatove and kreminna which will ultimately allow them to cut off the main Russian rail line supporting most of the region. And that says nothing about zaporizhzhia or over by Kherson.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
  4. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
  5. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
    There is a huge concentration of Russian forces there - led by some of the best trained Russian troops in theatre. The Ukrainians have essentially held them in one place for several months. I don't see how that is a bad thing for them, or a good thing for Russia.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    The reason Russia is there is because there are so many Ukrainians to kill there. Again, Russia is less interested in seizing territory than it is killing every Ukrainian troop that moves. If you kill everyone in a particular territory ... it’s easy to assume the territory.
     
  7. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    This could push Ukraine over the top ...

    upload_2022-12-10_10-48-51.jpeg
     
  8. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
    You keep saying this like if you say it enough it is true. The front line of the war right now is like 1300 KM long are something like that. This is a battle at ONE PLACE. There are active battles in several places along the line of contact. It's just amusing that you choose to ignore those because at best Russia is holding ground, and at worse, actively losing ground.

    Also if Russia was disinterested in holding terrain - why are they assaulting Ukrainian positions with troops in Bakhmut? Their losses have been insane there - why keep throwing men into the meat grinder if they don't care about terrain? You could accomplish the same thing just bombing the hell out of them and inviting them to attack you.
     
  9. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

    13,288
    1,834
    1,318
    Apr 3, 2007
    Russia is just lulling them into a false sense of security... Just waiting for them to set up hammocks and start drinking mai tai's on the front lines because fighting off the Russians has become so easy. Then the Russian army will come alive and stop acting like bumbling idiots.
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  10. VAg8r1

    VAg8r1 GC Hall of Fame

    20,204
    1,636
    1,763
    Apr 8, 2007
    @duggers_dad agrees.
     
  11. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    Ukro shills: We must hold Bakhmut at all costs!

    Also Ukro shills: Bakhmut has no strategic value whatsoever
     
  12. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    Nothing sneaky about what Russia is doing. As Clausewitz said: “Destroying armies, rather than capturing cities, is the quickest way to victory.”
     
  13. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    For the six or seventh time, because Ukraine is massing troops there. There are more troops to kill in Bakhmut.
     
  14. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
    Russian shills: Bakhmut is the key to victory! Ignore everything else!
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    In the last thirty days, Ukraine has lost the equivalent of 6 to 7 NATO brigades. Germany has a total of 8 brigades.

    Why wouldn’t Russia hang out there when their primary aim is destroying the Ukrainian (plus mercenaries) army ?
     
  16. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    There is no secret, according to Wagner’s Prigozhin himself ...

    “Our task is not Bakhmut itself, but the destruction of the Ukrainian army and the reduction of its combat potential, which has an extremely positive effect on other areas, which is why this operation was dubbed the 'Bakhmut meat grinder'.”
     
  17. slayerxing

    slayerxing GC Hall of Fame

    4,904
    834
    2,078
    Aug 14, 2007
    and russia has lost just as much. So I guess we should send Ukraine a thank you card for demilitarizing russua.
     
  18. duggers_dad

    duggers_dad GC Hall of Fame

    15,614
    1,155
    2,088
    Jan 5, 2022
    Utter nonsense. Western media is infected with twin tropes: (1) Bakhmut unimportant (2) Russia attacking Ukrainian defenses in human waves. Western media are overwhelmingly cooperative propagandized simps.
     
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  19. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

    13,288
    1,834
    1,318
    Apr 3, 2007
    Exactly. Ukraine has already been requested to reduce its fire rate of artillery shells so the U.S. can keep up with supplying them. Having the enemy concentrated in a small area makes the artillery fire that much more effective. Like shooting fish in a barrel.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  20. BigCypressGator1981

    BigCypressGator1981 GC Hall of Fame

    6,501
    1,332
    3,103
    Oct 11, 2011
    So weird that you can seemingly use periods correctly but can’t mark a question to save your life. What’s that about ?