POLL: Should the US trade Viktor Bout for Brittney Griner?

A couple of things

1) Who said it’s more important? Nobody it’s a bad faith argument.

2) How old are you? I ask that because you do not seem to understand how the world works. Putin doesn’t want to give up Wheelan for what we’re offering. We can’t make him do it. I suspect they want someone being held by Ukraine or some spy we don’t know about. It may not yet be in our power to trade them.

3) (This is aspirational) be less hateful it’s pretty clear your animus is based on her race sexuality and perceived (based on nothing) anti Americanism.

Finally inform yourself. You had no idea how much pot she had on her but it didn’t stop you from opining.

 

This was a doomed negotiation from the beginning. The only way you got Whalen and Griner home was to be willing to tell The Russians that they can keep Griner. The US was not going to do that, the Russians knew that hence the lack of leverage and the trade. I’m happy to see any U.S. citizen come home but this was never going to be a 2 for 1. JMHO

 

Even CNN questions the trade and if they question it, you know it's rankled the liberals.

 

Not dismissing it. Just asking. She is more high profile than other "more important" hostages. But most of us dont know those people.

(And by important I mean strategic, not in the realm of human life of which all are equal in these circumstances)

 

Is this the biggest WNBA trade ever?

 

Do you know how to read? Fogel does not equal Whalen. My animus is based on proritizing a popular person over an unknown person and leaving the older, more at risk, less healthy person behind because it was politically advantageous to do so. I am old emough to have worked my way out of a poverty syricken childhood to be a successful partner in a thriving engineering firm with 3 succesful adult children; which is totally irrelevant to the issue.

What is relevant is why it was politically advantageous to bring Griner home and leave Fogel behind. Answer that question if you are able

 

The best Biden could have done, sad to say, is to leave Griner in a Russian prison, and hope that it doesn't take too long for Russia to select a new dictator who wants to get along with the west. I have nothing against Griner, but you don't trade a notorious arms dealer known as the Merchant of Death for a basketball player or even a U.S. soldier. Just ask yourself the question: is humanity safer with both Griner and the Merchant of Death locked up, or with both of them free? Then ask, is it even close? Then finally, ask if it is the right thing to do to let the Merchant of Death out of prison.

This trade is the most idiotic thing since Obama traded five Taliban commanders for a deserter. Sometimes you wonder what the thought process is of these leaders. Democrat leaders probably shouldn't be allowed to trade anything more consequential than baseball cards. Putin must have laughed his ass off at the foolishness of Biden. No principles or sense at all. And what does that bode for the future? If you have a citizen who was committing crimes against the U.S. (or or allies) that happens to profit or help your country, and the U.S. locks him/her up, all you need to do is arrest an American on the street and fabricate charges, and wait for the U.S. gov't to make a trade. Someone needs to explain the "principle of law" concept to Biden.

 

I mean one of the strongest arguments in this thread is being made by an (honest) liberal...

 

Fogel is not a soldier. He is a 60 year old English teacher who worked at a school teaching diplomats kids.

 

You are living a fever dream. Brittneys release has zero to do with it being “politically advantageous ‘“ and everything to do with what could get done.

I’ve read your posts, the mature of your animus is clear to the discerning reader. But continue with your delusions.

 

But please tell me why Griner should have been freed instead of Whalen? Please justify it. I'm sure Russian would have been fine trading Bout for Whalen. The fact that none of you can deny is that the U.S. flat out chose Griner over Whalen.

Whalen has been detained in Russia for far longer than Griner and when push comes to shove the U.S. should negotiate for the release of Americans detained in Russia longer first.

But we all know the truth, even if many of you here don't want to admit it. Whalen was never a priority. Griner was a priority simply because she is a celebrity who is a black, trans, lesbian woman who will reliably vote Democrat.

If myself or any of you broke the same law that Griner broke we would be left by the U.S. Government to rot in Russia. Simple as that. Biden got who he wanted, Whalen will never get out of Russia alive.

And please, one of you tell me, why should we be trying to get a U.S. citizen who broke the laws of a foreign country? Yes the charges were far too absurd for the crime but that's Russia's decision, not the U.S. No one forced Griner to play in Russia and Griner should have left Russia months before she was arrested.

A country has every right to establish their own laws. If a country wants to kill someone for wearing a blue shirt they have that right. As a guest it was up to Griner to know and understand the law. The old saying is still true, ignorance of the law isn't an excuse. When in Rome do as the Romans do. Yes I think the law was BS but the fact is she still broke it. It's of course beyond interesting that aspect has been overlooked from the beginning. So why treat Griner different? We all know why.

 

You opened the door…

Yes, the Trump administration in 2020 agreed to the release of 5,000 Taliban prisoners

 

Curious… why didn’t Trump get him out? Was he in custody during his administration?

 

How do we know if Whalen's release was even possible, that the Russians were open to it at all?

 

If I was a relative of Whalen I'd be losing my mind right now. I would not be able to restrain myself being in the same room as Biden and would probably go to jail myself.

 

Stop deflecting, Trump isn't in office and hasn't been in office in almost two years. This is all on Biden.

 

Well guys the debate is over. CFlgator83 “is sure’ Russia would have been fine trading Bout for Whalen.

Biden screwed this up! Actually no what you’re arguing is Biden didn’t want to release Whalen. That is batshit insane.

Edit : Remind us again why Brittney was treated differently?

LOL.

 

Nah. Really?

 

If Biden had played hard ball and said you get Bout back but we get Whalen back I'm sure Whalen would be back here right now. The Russians probably didn't care who the U.S. got as long as they got Bout.

 

OK, you're just really sure. Got it.