I am certainly more inclined to support affirmative action, so long as it rewards the hardest working, most qualified candidate, despite their race.
No, you said that white people are "constantly" being told to beg for forgiveness. It isn't. No, you didn't. You showed one example of people choosing to do it without being asked and another person trying to mock people that are interested in racial justice as some sort of a joke against them. Neither of these shows that this is a common occurrence in earnest. Let me ask you this: how many times has a black person walked up to you and told you that you should beg him/her for his/her forgiveness? Because if it is happening constantly, you must have this happen quite often... No, you actually haven't done it once. You presented two things that didn't even come close to displaying the behavior you claimed was happening constantly. Reverse racism is a made up thing. There is no "reverse racism." There is racism. That can be against white people or some other race. The term "reverse racism" is itself a fascinating term to me. It explicitly recognizes that racism is itself a social organizing tool, which can be "reversed" to re-order society. But it should be important to recognize that people are not being "constantly" asked to beg for forgiveness and that the impression that it is happening is more likely to be a result of a general resentment of being asked to end the racism social organizing system that benefitted certain people (and even to recognize that such a system exists, which makes people feel bad when they do).
Not what I said. I am speaking collectively. There are absolutely massive wealth and opportunity gaps between Black and white people. Black people, as a group, aren't going to overcome what this country did to them without help. A country that treated them specially in order to harm them can treat them specially in order to help them. I am happy that your friends are successful. The fact that you're being sarcastic with that final sentence shows a blind spot imo. One of my clients is a Black man who lived through Jim Crow. He was an adult when the Civil Rights Act passed. He dealt with segregation while serving our country in the military. He was denied the opportunity to attend the University of Florida due to his race. Despite everything our country tried to do to squash him (no sarcasm), he became a wildly successful person. He overcame all of the barriers our country erected to stop him. A lot of people couldn't. While his story is one of triumph that we should celebrate, it's also a sad one. How many of his friends who did not succeed could have if given a fair shot and the same advantages that white kids had? They fit my narrative just fine. Black people succeeded even during Jim Crow. The idea isn't that it's impossible for an individual Black person to succeed. Rather, the idea is that Black people have to overcome more barriers---barriers that exist because of their race---to succeed. I want to live in a society where one's race doesn't advantage or disadvantage them. We're nowhere near that society. One of my best friends is a college-educated Black man who has never been arrested for a crime. My friend and I are similar drivers. We both speed (5-10 mph, generally), but not excessively. I haven't been pulled over in the past decade. My friend gets pulled over multiple times a year. I've never had an officer ask to search my car. My friend has had officers seek to search his car at least once a year. Why do you think that is? And I'll note that my friend is an engineer at one of America's largest companies. He's a success story. Yet, why do you think police officers regard him as more suspicious than me? We still have a lot of work to do as a society.
Lawyer just gave me my second ever c’mon man bacon. The first one kinda bothered me. This one I’m rather proud of. Maybe the real life examples of my friends that don’t support his narrative bother him. I realize that my anecdotes, while true and meaningful, might not be the norm for all black folk; but I would bet that they aren’t rare, either. Attitude is a choice. A bad attitude or feeling sorry for yourself is, too; and deciding to acquiesce to less than ideal circumstances and give up is a guarantee for failure. My buddies and I didn’t. No one has to. I will get on another plane and sit back without internet (hell no I’m not paying $8) and await his third bacon. I love bacon.
You got a c'mon man because you misrepresented what I said and then decided to rebut the straw man you created. (Also, c'mon man and bacon are separate ratings. )
Not on the plane yet. I agree there is work to be done. I try to be part of that effort every day but there is only so much one typical white boy can do. TWB is something my buds used to call me. I’m still a TWB. I think individuals can have profound impact when working together and not against each other. Opportunity is out there. One simply has to want it more than other poor choices. See#566. I call truce. Have a fabulous Thanksgiving. Everyone has more to be thankful for than not.
He is going to be very pushy about how you should feel. Not because he gives a damn personally, but because he’s paid to push a narrative. Without that narrative, he and his associates would be out of a job. And yes, I did predict a Dr. Oz win and I was wrong. And I can admit when I was wrong, unlike gator_lawyer, who will never admit he is wrong, because his paycheck depends on it. People like you tear gator_lawyer up, because you and your friends did it without him and he can’t have that. If that keeps happening, he is no longer needed. Enjoyed your posts, by the way…
LOL. I don't work for the Democratic Party. Keep grasping at straws. The government violating people's rights is what keeps me employed. And I unfortunately have a lot of job security right now.
Ley me ask you a simple question and then I am done with this discussion. If you saw the same two videos but it was black people taking a knee in front of White people begging for forgiveness would it make your skin crawl just a little. Would you find it funny and laugh it off or might you think "We just don't need this kind of stuff in a racially charged society". If you can change the color of the characters and have the same reaction either way then I credit you if not than you are a hypocrite. You don't need to answer me just answer yourself and move on. I made my point accept it or refute it. Either way I don't give a damn. I know for myself that these sorts of shenanigans sets us back. Lastly I personally saw a video of a group of Black Lives Matter members confronting 3 women that came out of their apartment building in New York being told to take a knee and beg for forgiveness. You can believe me or not again I don't give a damn either way. It was very interesting what reverse racism means to you or have you never heard that term before either.
Depends on what they were doing it for. Given that they were not the advantaged group by the social order established by racism, nor the people that set it up, it would be a very strange video, given the current context. I already told you that I didn't find the right-winger trying to mock the left by approaching people on the street particularly funny. I refuted it by pointing out that you didn't provide any evidence of something you claim happens "constantly." Because it doesn't. So at the end of the day, your best evidence is that you believe it happened once, but can't provide any evidence to back it. Okay.
Were the American Indians wronged more than the slaves? History is full of wrongs. How would you go about fixing them all?
Why arrest people for crimes? Society is full of wrongs. Why allow people to sue those who harmed them? People get hurt all the time. Why should we try to remedy that wrong if we can't remedy all wrongs? Why should we try to convict that person if we can't convict all persons? Respectfully, I don't find the argument you're making persuasive. We certainly can and should look into addressing the harms (including the ongoing harm) to Native Americans and figuring out ways to close the opportunity gap for them too. Indeed, there are affirmative action policies in this country that seek to do that.
As for segregation in neighborhoods of cities, there are more factors than simply where people are living that you would need to take into account. You would need to look at the 'why' as well. For instance, how much money do the people in those neighborhoods make? If I am making 100k a year, Im probably not going to move to an apartment complex in a crime-ridden neighborhood. Idk the stats but I would think most crime areas are also in poverty. IF the neighborhood is predominantly black AND crime-ridden, no whites are going move there. That takes those neighborhoods off the board, so you can't factor that into segregation. Thats often certain inner-city areas as well, probably Detroit. If I'm single, no kids, and making 60k a year, maybe I find an apartment complex in a younger, 'hip' community where there are others like me. Lets go further. Who are the 'others like me?' There are some legitimate culture differences between us. If I'm an 'edgy', 'hipster' type of person, maybe I find an area downtown by the bars where the young, single community thrives. Do blacks WANT to live there? Maybe. But maybe they dont either. Maybe some blacks would rather stay in their childhood neighborhoods because thats what feels right to them. People are doing what makes them comfortable. Are we really talking about this? The truth remains, no one is FORCING us to be segregated, you can basically move wherever you want to. People are making decisions based off of comfort. But if I were to move into a black neighborhood, I would treat them as I would any other neighbors, and I would expect them to do the same. But do they really want me in their neighborhoods? Maybe they want to be left alone and not feel like theyre being intruded upon. This works both ways brother As for the word, what is it that you really want? That solution would drown out its old use, so when it is said by whites(who favor blacks) the shock value continually decreases and it continues to lose power. No longer would you be angry and offended by someone like Stokes who "had the audacity to say it without insult because he didnt think twice about the past" and he is living in a different world than your parents did. Its not just benefiting him, its benefiting the minds of blacks who are holding on to the previous use of the word. Things are changing. So maybe try to change the word now. Youre not going to wake up one day and see the world you want to see. The longer this stuff lingers in your mind the longer you are going to be angry. Stay away from the news and what people are supposedly reporting to be happening in other places. For instance, the second I stopped watching the news, the virus largely disappeared. Last thing, I got a quick story then I'll let all this go. About two months ago, there was a stray dog running around my parents' neighborhood. After seeing the dog by himself for a few days running around the neighborhood, they were able to get ahold of him, and they took him to the vet to see if he had a chip, which, if he was chipped, would tell them who the owner is. He didnt have a chip, so they took him back to their house, took some pics of him, and put them on the NextDoor app to see if someone would claim him. After a couple days of him staying with my parents, he really grew on my dad, and when no one claimed him, my dad decided to keep him because he really liked him. He was friendly, didnt pee in the house or chase their cat. A week or so after they got him, I was at their house at night and I decided to take him for a walk. I grew up in that house and neighborhood, and I still have friends that I grew up with there. As I was walking him, a black friend of mine who I grew up with pulled up to his house in his car. This is an old friend who is black and favors blacks, and Ive slept at his house, ate with him, everything as a teen. Its night outside, and this dog barks at noises, movements, and people, like some dogs do. So my friend gets out the car and walks towards me to say what's up, and the dog starts barking at him. Thankfully, hes just a small dog so my friend wasn't worried at all, but unfortunately, this dog is ALL white with just a few brown spots. As I try to hush the dog, my black friend says, "Damn bro, that dog's racist." I would usually brush something like that off as a joke, but he said it with such a straight face and didnt laugh, that, in my head, I wondered if he was serious. I just said, "My bad bro(for the dog barking), my parents just got him last week, and we dont really know how he acts around people." We then talked for a minute, and parted ways. The only reason I bring this up is because if he was just joking, why was that the first thing he thought to say about a white dog barking at him? We grew up together, he knows me as a person, and he has dogs himself. What I took from this is that black people themselves have differing opinions on what IS and what IS NOT offensive or racist. But by throwing the word around so loosely, more things inherently begin to constitute as racist or offensive to the people who think that way. This is what keeping things that aren't really offensive or racist in the news does. It continues to keep "tension" high, and past thoughts and feelings will linger for no reason. The less my friend maybe hears about stuff like Stokes' incident(Idk if he has or hasnt), the less those thoughts will linger. While I dont see him often, I don't think he's experiencing true discrimination on a continual basis. He told me he works in a warehouse, has a kid now, and his girlfriend and kid are staying in an apartment in a rough area. What he is experiencing on a daily basis is likely completely different than what he might see on the news. I'm just saying don't let the news effect YOUR experiences in your daily life. Things that are being called racist or offensive are getting out of hand, and I would hate to think that an old friend of mine might actually think that my parents' dog is racist?
For white people to not use the word. It's actually a really simple solution. It is directly the opposite of your solution of white people using the word much more often. Have you tried running your idea past Black people you know? Seems like the sort of thing you'd want to get input on from the people who could be most harmed by it. I can tell you from personal experience that I don't think it would go over well with the majority of Black people. Here's some evidence of that: That's definitely not what happened. Maybe you were fortunate to have no loved ones harmed by COVID, but I didn't get the luxury of pretending the virus didn't exist when it killed one of my family members. Who gets to decide what's "really" racist or offensive? And I'd caution you not to make assumptions about what your friend is and isn't facing in his daily life. You haven't walked a mile in his shoes. This is from the same Pew research as the chart above and shows quite a gap between white and Black views on racial issues, particularly discrimination and equality. It indicates to me many white people have a real blind spot on these issues: Link: Race in America 2019
I don't use the word and dont intend to. I personally have no need or want for it. Even if something as wrong as my random idea was tried, I still wouldnt use it. And I mean random in every sense of the word. I have NEVER thought about having whites who are close to blacks use it on purpose(given consent of course) to try to change the meaning of the word. This is the first time its ever crossed my mind, and no I hadn't ran it by any of my black friends. But there are plenty of whites who grow up in poverty, in predominantly black neighborhoods, who would be given the "hall pass" because their black brothers know these whites are more like them than not, and are not trying to offend. Its simply an idea that, IF someone wants even more change, they might try. I go back to whatever the current state of racism is. Do YOU think things are getting better? I can ask you, then ask Lil Wayne, and I will get two different answers. I can ask you, then someone in another city, and I will get two different answers. You, then a teen, two different answers. How you view racism going is going to determine how much change you feel is necessary. If the real goal is to change the mind of people who are TRULY racist, you are probably going to have a difficult time. You would also have to somehow quantify how many racists are in the world. If that is the end goal, you might have an easier time changing how you feel about their actions and what they've done to you, than trying to change them. I'm sorry I can't understand what you have been through, but there is no possible way for me to understand either. Sometimes, for us, it feels like people would rather condemn us for not having gone through those things, than realizing we cant. You telling me what it feels like to be called that word couldnt really help me, because while I dont like being called a cracker, being called a cracker might not compare. Nonetheless, if someone calls me a cracker, it is what it is. Whether they get a scholarship to Florida or not, is what it is. It would be better for me to forget about it, than to let it bother me. The longer I think about something like that, the more power I give it over me. If I constantly think this world is going to hell in a handbasket, eventually that is going to be my reality; even if the world isnt going to hell in a handbasket. I give you one last story. For the past 9 years I worked at a warehouse, though I decided to switch it up a few months ago. Anyone who hasnt worked in a warehouse might not know they tend to be employed by more blacks than whites, at least in my city. This one was probably 70/30 black to white. Its very physical work. I was cool with everyone there, and only had a few disputes with people over work load and performance. As a white guy, where there were more blacks, if you asked any black about me, they would ALL say "Oh yeah, he's cool as f***" GUARANTEED. But one day like 3 years ago, a black guy(x) that I was close with came to me and told me this other black guy(y), who I was actually cool with and talked to daily at work as well, had told him that he thought I was racist. I asked my black friend(x) why the other guy(y) said that, like what happened, and he told me the guy(y) had no reason, nothing happened, he just said he thought I was. The good thing was, my black friend(x) who told me all of this, knew this other guy(y) likes to talk about everybody, and knew he was always full of shi*. Everyone in the warehouse knew he(y) just talks out his a** about other people. The crazy thing was I actually liked him and his personality, because he was a character. Anyways, the friend(x) told me he just wanted to let me know because it was so absurd the other guy(y) would say that, that it caught him off guard. I tell you those stories because incidents like those indicate to me the word racist can be thrown around very unjustly and very irresponsibly among some people as well. Im not saying that to diminish the real discrimination people deal with, I'm just saying you also have to be cautious of some claims of racism. Not every claim of discrimination or racism is true or because someone is actually racist. Its very hard to quantify racism today when the word is being thrown around so lightly.
You must be talking to @gator_lawyer I can’t see anything they write since they blocked me. But that is what weak minded bullies do. They scream like a petulant child and run from others and their ideas.
