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House oversight committee gets to root of inflation... corporate greed.

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by citygator, Nov 7, 2022.

  1. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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    Yeah I am seeing it the same way. I think we would probably need evidence of widespread collusion among corporations to make this theory work. And that would be illegal.
     
  2. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Totally agree about collusion. I would even argue that inflation may provide what's known as a focal pt. A focal pt is a mechanism that helps firms engage in implicit collusion. Hey, there's inf, this is a good time for everybody to raise prices....

    to me, it ain't that esoteric. I think it is supply & demand.
     
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  3. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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    I think the challenge to this explanation is that industries aren’t individuals; they are populations made up of individuals.

    Imagine there is an industry with only two corporations. If both corporations, A and B, doubled their prices together, they both make more money. Agreed. But both would probably notice that breaking this tie would be selfishly advantageous. If B raises prices to 2.0X, corp A would receive a windfall by simply dropping their prices to 1.7X. This would of course hurt B, who would be forced to then drop their prices in response. Pretty soon, these corporations would both end up right back at 1.0X.

    …unless they are price fixing.
     
  4. citygator

    citygator VIP Member

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    Some opinion mixed with facts below…

    First, price increases can raise or lower margins depending on price elasticity.

    Second, price elasticity isn’t always rational in the short term. Ask JC Penney who went bankrupt trying to go to everyday pricing from high low advertising and the customer reaction was terrible.

    Third, All these price moves have given suppliers and retailers a means to collude on pricing instead of compete. Lumber prices go up and overnight HD and Lowes change their prices up and make much more profit on what they bought. Only works because they both do it. HD knows Lowes will match their move the same day. That is unusual in these times. Competition usually holds these prices down and will over time but in the short run it’s not working.

    Summary of my opinion: the supply shortages led to price increases but they are magnified by an environment where companies are silently colluding on pricing. Regardless it’s not demand driven.
     
  5. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Which brings me to my theory of high energy prices. Going back to (i think) 2014, oil companies pretty drastically lowered their development investments world wide. OPEC has always had trouble getting members to stick to their price fixing. There is no commitment device. But, strategic underinvestment is easily observable & does serve as a commitment device. You can't pump oil from non existent wells. Anyway, I've made a killing on energy stocks.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
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  6. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    Don't worry, if its price gouging he's got an argument that that is a good thing too
     
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  7. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    true. But a big diff is "price gouging" is caused by consumers (shift in demand)
     
  8. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    I dont think that's true, I think capitalists think of new ways to extract money from pretty stable demand and supply, like how NFL teams figured out they can charge money for the right to buy seats (seat license), and then charge you again for the actual tickets. Its really up to interpretation if you think that's simply innovation borne of greed, or "well people will pay it because they like football."
     
  9. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    agree
     
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  10. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    You got a degree in a field that presupposes rational human behavior
     
  11. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    utterly false. off the top of my head Khanman (Tevesky if he'd lived), Nash, Simon, V. Smith & Roth got nobel prizes. their careers were about demonstrating "irrational" behavior (hell 3 of those folks aren't even economists. )
     
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  12. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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    It is the job of corporations primarily to represent shareholder interests, the primary interest of which is to return wealth to shareholders. To have an opportunity to raise prices, and to not do so, would be a breach of their fiduciary responsibility as well as counter to simple economic theory.
     
  13. Trickster

    Trickster VIP Member

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    Damn! That's a bassakwards way of !looking at it IMO. "We don't have enough; consumers want - need! - it; so let's gouge 'em", and it's somehow the consumers' "fault"? I suppose it's true to an extent, but I look at it at the front end. It's often not the consumers' fault there isn't enough.
     
  14. wgbgator

    wgbgator Premium Member

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    And that is a big problem for civilization. Cant imagine anything different than the reality created by capitalist innovation like "shareholder value" (itself an innovation of the innovation of public trading).
     
  15. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

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    So you don't think corporations could be using inflation to justify prices increases so they can increase their profits (which leads to more inflation)?
     
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  16. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    Never said that. In fact, I clearly said that they could up thread.
     
  17. GatorRade

    GatorRade Rad Scientist

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    Clever.
     
  18. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

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    That's just a silly statement. In a well-functioning market prices and costs should be well correlated all else being equal. If they aren't something is wrong with the market.
     
  19. docspor

    docspor GC Hall of Fame

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    prices are based on value. Surely, you can think of a situation where you'd gladly pay $1000 for a bottle of water. How much you think that cardigan cost to make?


    [​IMG]
     
  20. dangolegators

    dangolegators GC Hall of Fame

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    So corporations using inflation to justify price increases (to make larger profits) are a cause of inflation?