Stacey Abrams...lower than dirt

Clearly those OB Gyns are dumber than dirt also. They probably even got vaccinated. Multiple times!!

 

I agree. Which is why I was showing an attempt to say when something is "alive" scientifically is not feasible. Personally, I agree with you and always felt when the brain started showing more advanced function was when I draw the line. Roughly week 19-20

 

Yeah, I think you can poke a hole in almost any delineation of what is or isn't alive and when. That's what makes it such an interesting conversation. We will classify someone as "brain dead" when the rest of their body is functioning. And allow legal killing at that point. But now some states won't allow termination even before brain activity. Which doesn't make sense theoretically. And again, we'll classify animals as alive thay don't have a brain, or heart.

I'm with you, and always felt like the ability to feel pain was a pretty reasonable line to draw. But even that gets weird the more we learn about things like insects. It has recently been discovered they feel something similar to pain

 

I would consider a heartbeat in itself fairly trivial as most forms of multiple cell life have a circulatory system. If a fetus has no cognition, at all, and doesn’t feel pain it really doesn’t have the traits that differentiate it as human life. I agree the pro life thing is a religious value. They believe that the life itself in itself is special because it was divined by God. They believe it has a “soul”. Arguably an early term fetus in its current state isn’t effectively different than a brain dead human being.

None of this is to imply the life of the fetus doesn’t have value. It clearly does. But the value is largely tied in to its parents and family that value its eventuality. The fact that it has value does not supersede the woman’s choice to determine what happens in her own body.

 

This thread went well.

 

Ha, thfsg lefty logic at it's best.

 

She's all for killing the blobs of cells up to and after they're born but has suddenly changed her stance to put the onus on the physician. Guess it didn't focus group very well.

 

It's not a manufactured sound. Its actually a sound. Even Planned Parenthood acknowledged it. Calling it a manufactured sound is dumb.

What, does each conservative bring a recording of a heartbeat and play 9t on their phones to trick the doctors?

I hear all 3 of my kids heartbeats. Didnt you? Did you "manufacture" it?

 

Seems she wouldn't say something some made up and dumb. Her comment was "manufactured" out of thin air.

 

What does Herschel say? He could clear all this up right away.

 

It’s inaudible and manufactured to sound like a heartbeat. Sounds pretty right on to me. I don’t care though. If you want an abortion get yourself to an American state and get one.

 

If you and your fellow pro-lifers are so concerned about "unborn" or "preborn" children why are you not supporting universal access to prenatal care for pregnant women, keeping in mind and especially under your implicit definition the real patients of the care aren't just the pregnant women but also their unborn children? In fact, the a significant percentage of prolifers conservatives actively opposed the prenatal care mandate in the ACA, their argument being that people who cannot get pregnant shouldn't be compelled to subsidize the care of pregnant women.

 

what about the doctors who say there there is no heartbeat because there are no valves and that , while there is some electrical activity, the sound you hear is created by the ultrasound machine?

 

Exactly, God forbid you disturb a sea turtle nest on any of Florida’s beaches…

 

Unless things have changed in Florida every pregnant woman can get “free care” via medicaid regardless of income.

 

Sound like a former President who was routinely called dumb for 8 years.

 

Although not completely clear, it seems from the state's website that while every woman can receive referral information from the state, to receive free care a woman still has to qualify for Medicaid although the state does provide assistance while a woman's application for Medicaid is pending she still has to be income eligible.
From the website:

Prenatal Care | Florida Department of Health

 

I laughed because I could actually see a liberal poster saying this as parody. But I don't think you're being satirical here, which makes it all the more funny.

The Texas Abortion Ban Hinges On 'Fetal Heartbeat.' Doctors Call That Misleading
"When I use a stethoscope to listen to an [adult] patient's heart, the sound that I'm hearing is caused by the opening and closing of the cardiac valves," says Dr. Nisha Verma, an OB-GYN who specializes in abortion care and works at the American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists.

The sound generated by an ultrasound in very early pregnancy is quite different, she says.

"At six weeks of gestation, those valves don't exist," she explains. "The flickering that we're seeing on the ultrasound that early in the development of the pregnancy is actually electrical activity, and the sound that you 'hear' is actually manufactured by the ultrasound machine."

I don't think Bush was dumb, but Stacey Abrams also wasn't a legacy at Yale, didn't have a wealthy and renowned family, and didn't have a grandfather serving as a U.S. Senator just before she applied.

 

Or any number of very well educated pubs over the years.

 

Most people opposed to the ACA were not opposed based on prenatal care.

What most opposed was the methodology of implementation and or loopholes like the "family glitch" which blocked millions from using it.

Of course some conservatives have a non compassionate view of the ACA which angers me as a supporter of health care, but the ACA has left a lot of people out (and that doesnt get much publicity).