Ban on gas fracking in England lifted in push for energy independence

You should move to Britain, Rick.

 

Or Venezuela. They nationalized their O&G. #dreamy

 

Assuming we survive this Ukraine fiasco a lot good will have come of it. It has reminded us again of our need to keep a diverse energy supply, among other things.

 

I hope this pushes us further into renewables and out of the global O&G game. There is no such thing as "energy independance" with O&G as currently configured.

 

Funny. the people bitching the most about radical communism are all about collectivism when it comes to the weird, dumb goal of energy independence. to me it is schizophrenic (O&G is strategically important, so let's consume our own when others have no choice but to sell it to us). oh, & typically these same peeps will - with not the slightest hint of irony & the utmost lack of self-awareness - call any conservation policies - or, hell, even EVs - radical communism. The worst of the commie tendencies are the ones that preach autarky. Pol Pot should not be our economic/national security muse.

 

100%, but hydrocarbons for the moment are still essential to power this economy. I’m all for maximizing hydro, solar, wind, tidal, etc, but it is not enough. We need to go nuclear to provide electricity to power all of these electric cars. And almost no matter what, heavy machinery, including and especially military vehicles, are going to need petroleum-based fuel. In order to have energy independence as an essential element of national security, we need to compromise with each other on these matters.

 

Let’s characterize it differently then. Autarky usually means a state depending solely on itself. The kind of energy independence I envision is within the larger context of our alliance. I would like our alliance of Western democracies to be able to fully power each other without having to rely on our enemies in any way.

 

yeah, but let's not make enemies along the way - 1st, do no harm? trade is a great, if not the greatest path to peace. Also, a healthier way IMO of thinking about EI is to have the capacity to provide your own energy which is quite diff from actually providing your own when your "enemies" will sell to you on the cheap.

 

I speak to ability to not trade with them, which we don’t currently have, not a permanent unwillingness to do so.

 

it's trade which is the greatest creator of wealth that's ever existed. CREATOR! let's not screw it up with big gov paranoia.

 

So, for instance, we should not screw with trade with Russia while they are invading their neighbor and literally threatening the world with nuclear war? I want to have and maintain the ability for the rest of Europe to halt energy trade, without catastrophic difficulties, under circumstances such as we are now in. I’m not sure how that’s a bad thing.

 

you just made an arg for the importance of trade....you can't take away something that does not exist.

 

Clarify.

 

I’m all for renewables but it is going to take quite a while before we can exclusively rely upon it. Not having a backup plan leaves us vulnerable, both from an energy supply standpoint and geopolitical standpoint. I recently read that with batteries, which are crucial to the long term success of electric vehicles and renewable storage, even by 2035 more than 60% of battery production will still be in China, and a higher share the years before that. We reduce our dependence on Middle East and Russia, in order to be dependent on China? We are an invasion of Taiwan away from yet another crisis. That’s doesn’t speak of the various dependencies we will have for battery raw materials.

 

If I am the only dentist in town & Jane is the only doctor, we have incentive to trade even if we hate each other. trade makes us "less" enemies. Now, we could both be ridiculous & get dual degrees/specialties/experience as docs & dentists & just be enemies cuz we'd have lessened the fact that we enrich one another's lives & I'd have less to lose if I shot her in the head.

You seem to have an us v. them mentality. But, who's us & who's them? big gov creates that & it is BS. trade weakens big gov's creation of fake enemies.

 

Nextgen nuclear is the solution. Pair nuclear plants with desal plants. Desal much more efficient with heated water. Desal plant can flex flow to flex demand to capture nuclear excess production capacity and remove heat from the system. Pump water uphill where possible to create closed loop hydrostorage batteries

 

I can’t tell if we’re talking past each other or not. Russia has created the present us-versus-them mentality, not big government. China postures to do the same by likewise invading its sovereign neighbor under fictional pretexts of “that used to belong to me and I want it back.” Trading with the U.S. is a privilege, for the mutual benefit of both parties. I have no wish to provide benefits to such countries who would engage in this kind of behavior, even if it means some degree of sacrifice on our part. What I am saying is that we must generate and maintain a situation where we and likeminded nations can cut off trade and survive if necessary.

 

What! Russia & China IS BIG GOV!!??????? Russia has 144m people & China has a whole hell of a lot. You squished 'em all into 2 chess pieces on the board, mostly controlled by 2 assholes- 'ats the real destruction of BIG GOV - creating your mindset! Doc, out! This ain't a game of Risk.

 

I'm not anti nuke on its face. Show me a path to affordable, scalable, safe nuclear and I'd vote for it. But renewables with storage are 100% the future. We don't have to rely on china or anyone else to accomplish it. It's no longer a technical or resource issue. It's a political issue. We need to decide to make it the future. That's the lesson I hope we learn from this mess.