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Water Wars - Mexico

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by G8trGr8t, Jun 16, 2022.

  1. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    The Bureau of Reclamation, a federal agency, takes a stand on the whole water issue with Lake Powell and Lake Mead, by refusing to do their job.

    Apparently, the plan to save a tanking Lake Mead and Lake Powell is 'stay tuned'

    Now, mind you, the Bureau only has one job here with regard to these two lakes. So it takes a lot of leadership to refuse to do that job. That's how you know that it's the federal government at work.
     
  2. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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  3. WC53

    WC53 GC Hall of Fame

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    Old City
    Afraid of causing water riots by letting the source go dry and causing water riots.
    Imagine, mass population and agriculture in desert areas causing problems. Who would have thunk it . Pray for snow.
     
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  4. OklahomaGator

    OklahomaGator Jedi Administrator Moderator VIP Member

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    How much rainfall in the Lake Mead watershed would it take to fill it back to max capacity?
     
  5. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I am calculating 9.95 feet (119 inches) of rain, without evaporation or water soaking into the soil. I'm sure the real answer is many multiples higher than that. Mobile, Alabama is usually near the top of continental U.S. rainfall lists, and they have about 66 inches a year.

    Lake Mead watershed = 2200 sq mi.
    640 acres / sq mi.
    Lake Mead capacity = 28.23 MM acre-feet
    Lake Mead current volume = 14.21 MM acre-feet
    Lake Mead available volume = 14.02 MM acre-feet

    The primary contributor of water to Lake Mead is not rainfall, it is snow-melt from higher elevations. The recent flooding only added a few inches to the lake. Compare that to the 27 feet that the level of the lake has dropped in the last 12 months. The most rain that was measured in the Vegas flooding was only an inch or so--to most of the U.S., that would be a moderate and fairly routine rainstorm. It caused flooding because the dirt is so dry it quickly turned to mud (and there weren't enough plants and trees to soak up the water).

    EarthSky | Shrinking Lake Mead reveals bodies and boats

    There is just too many people and too much agriculture relying on that water source.
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2022
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  6. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Good post. I actually wish that Biden would use this opportunity (after the price of gas came down) to ratchet up the federal taxes on gas to bring the price of gas up to $3.75-4.25 a gallon. Even the most dimwitted republican would have to admit that he was a freeloader driving on highways that require $0.40-0.50/gallon gas taxes while paying $0.18/gal in federal gas taxes to maintain the highways. Our economy survived a brief brush with $5.00/gallon gas--we could survive with $4.00/gal gas. It might make sense to increase minimum wage to help poor people afford gas (and inflation), but that could be done gradually with the gas tax hikes. If the gas tax hikes were $0.02-0.03 per quarter, and the minimum wage hikes were $0.25/yr, it would have almost no impact on the economy, and the working poor would more than make up for the additional cost of gas with the additional income.
     
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  7. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    I would also say that Las Vegas needs to tax the hell out of water. So much so that people start abandoning the city. The city should never have been allowed to grow to its current size without the natural resources to support it. People in both southern California and Nevada pay about $70-80 a month for water, and it probably needs to be much higher than that in both places. Especially if California ever gets their act together and decides to invest in desalinization.
     
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  8. homer

    homer GC Hall of Fame

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    There’s an article in todays Tampa Bay Times about drought in China. Farmer losing most of his crop.


    Will water become the new gold?
     
  9. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    There are probably some crops in the southeast U.S. lost to excessive flooding this year. You can also lose crops when water arrives at the wrong time. The value of water goes down exponentially when you have way too much of it.

    In northwest Florida, I tell people who are looking at houses not to ask about irrigation--ask about drainage. Especially people who are new to the area. Keeping water on the lawns is not a problem; handling the 5"+ rainstorms is a much bigger issue. The record for rainfall in this area is 26" in 24 hours, set eight years ago.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2022
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  10. sierragator

    sierragator GC Hall of Fame

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    Vegas is not sustainable for the long haul. Eventually the desert will win.
     
  11. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Without Lake Mead, Vegas probably would have been abandoned long ago, like the resorts at the edge of California's Salton Sea.

    Salton Sea, California – Ghost Town Lake in the Desert – Legends of America

     
  12. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    How would you like to live in the other Las Vegas--the one in New Mexico? It's a small town of 10,000 on the edge of a forest, which was recently devastated by wildfires, which were apparently started by the government. The residents have less than 30 days of drinking water left. Muddy, ash-laden runoff from the mountainside is threatening to contaminate their drinking water supply.

    NM city, victim of government burn, now faces water shortage

     
  13. chemgator

    chemgator GC Hall of Fame

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    Flooding is now occurring throughout the Southwest, and people there are not happy. I wish these people would make up their minds: do they want water or not?

    Evacuations ordered, emergency declared in eastern Arizona floods

     
  14. BLING

    BLING GC Hall of Fame

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    The flood waters might not be of much use to them, might even contaminate their reservoirs. I’ve heard of this happening before. You get a quick storm after a period of extended drought and because the soil is basically hardpan, the flash flood is exacerbated because the water doesn’t permeate into the soil as it normally would.
     
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  15. l_boy

    l_boy 5500

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  16. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Wyoming girds for a fight over Green, Little Snake River water (msn.com)

    A water fight is brewing in the West, and Wyoming water officials want to prepare for it with a study aimed at parsing and defining the state’s consumption from its Colorado River tributaries.

    Anticipating a drier future and either voluntary or imposed restrictions, Wyoming should undertake a “conveyance-loss study,” Jason Mead, interim director of the Wyoming Water Development Office, told the state Water Development Commission on Oct. 6. The goal, State Engineer Brandon Gebhart told the WWDC, is to have a “defensible consumptive-use number to take to the other states,” when and if push comes to shove and Colorado River Basin water users face cuts to irrigation, industrial or municipal uses.

    When Colorado River Basin water rights were divvied up starting in 1922, officials overestimated the amount of water the system would produce each year and ultimately promised more water to stakeholders than actually existed. Climate change, drought, shifting weather patterns and a population explosion in the region have exacerbated that initial over-subscription.

    Further complicating the picture, the U.S. Bureau of Reclamation — the government’s Western water agency — admits there’s “an inability to exactly quantify these uses.” This “has led to various differences of opinion” regarding who gets to use how much water, the BOR states in a 2022 accounting of the river’s flows and uses.
     
  17. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    Middle eastern countries shippng millions of gallons of water in alfalfa to the ME to feed their cattle while private and muni wells go dry. Large scale food and crop production needs to relocate out of arid climates

    Wells are running dry in drought-weary Southwest as foreign-owned farms guzzle water to feed cattle overseas | CNN

    Now frustration is growing in Arizona’s La Paz County, as shallower wells run dry amid the Southwest’s [COLOR=var(--theme-paragraph__link-color)]worst drought in 1,200 years[/COLOR]. Much of the frustration is pointed at the area’s huge, foreign-owned farms growing thirsty crops like alfalfa, which ultimately get shipped to feed cattle and other livestock overseas.

    You can’t take water and export it out of the state, there’s laws about that,” said Arizona geohydrologist Marvin Glotfelty, a well-drilling expert. “But you can take ‘virtual’ water and export it; alfalfa, cotton, electricity or anything created in part from the use of water.”
    Residents and local officials say lax groundwater laws give agriculture the upper hand, allowing farms to pump unlimited water as long as they own or lease the property to drill wells into. In around 80% of the state, Arizona has no laws overseeing how much water corporate megafarms are using, nor is there any way for the state to track it.


     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
  18. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    feds proposing to cut water rights to states receiving Colorado River water unilaterally and equally. seems reasonable

    Biden's Colorado River Proposal Will Cut Water to Three States (msn.com)

    The Biden Administration is taking action to preserve the dwindling water in the Colorado River, a proposal from the United States Department of Interior (DOI) revealed on Tuesday.

    Stressed by population growth, overuse and parched by a years-long drought that has plagued the region, the Colorado River is suffering. States in the lower Colorado basin have been negotiating for months to draft a plan that would preserve the valuable resource while continuing to provide water service to millions of residents and fuel the nation's agricultural industry.

    Required water cuts have already been implemented and increased in severity this year for Arizona and Nevada. Western states are scrambling to come up with a solution that preserves their access to Colorado River water while uniting the region on a path to recovery for the drought-stricken river and its associated reservoirs.
    ..........................
    One of the solutions proposes equal cuts for three states in the lower Colorado River basin: California, Arizona and Nevada. The decision would impose cuts on California, which has thus far emerged from the Colorado River allocation changes relatively unscathed. California water officials have previously spoken out against proposals reducing water allocation in the Golden State, reasoning that the proposals violate the Law of the River, which respects state's water rights based on seniority.
     
  19. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

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    seems foolish to distribute full commitments while still ahving to withdraw water from the Colorado.

    California to deliver all of requested water supplies for first time in 17 years (msn.com)

    April 21 (UPI) -- California's Department of Water Resources expects to deliver 100% of the state's requested water supplies this year with reservoirs close to full capacity and snowmelt runoff beginning.

    After years of drought, it's the first 100% allocation in 17 years.

    "Water supply conditions and careful management of reservoir operations during this extreme winter allows DWR to maximize water deliveries while enhancing protections for the environment," said DWR Director Karla Nemeth in a statement. "DWR is moving and storing as much water as possible to the benefit of communities, agriculture, and the environment."
    ..................................................

    Despite the full reservoirs, southern California still depends on water from the Colorado River system, which is in a 23-year drought. So the DWR urged California residents to continue to use water wisely "to help the state adapt to a hotter, drier future."
     
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  20. Emmitto

    Emmitto VIP Member

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    The west got a gift with the heavy precip this year. Politicians will frame it as the new normal and squander this gift.
     
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