Welcome home, fellow Gator.

The Gator Nation's oldest and most active insider community
Join today!

DeSantis Higher Ed approach

Discussion in 'Too Hot for Swamp Gas' started by G8trGr8t, Jul 2, 2022.

  1. G8trGr8t

    G8trGr8t Premium Member

    31,143
    11,994
    3,693
    Aug 26, 2008
    Making headlines for all the wrong reasons. I wasn't aware of some of the golas of having elected officials in charge of hiring and firing of professors or removing state universities from accreditation programs. I hope the judges strike this nonsense down. Tenure needs review but this approach is too much

    In Florida, DeSantis’s plans for colleges rattle some academics (msn.com)

    In his efforts to remake higher education in Florida, Gov. Ron DeSantis has signed laws that alter the tenure system, remove Florida universities from commonly accepted accreditation practices, and mandate annual “viewpoint diversity surveys” from students and faculty.

    Cassanello, who teaches classes in civil rights movements, Jim Crow America, and emancipation and Reconstruction argued that the law “restricts his ability to accurately and fully teach these subjects.”

    Meanwhile, the board of governors for Florida’s public university system took initial steps Thursday to approve regulations for enforcing the law, with potential penalties including discipline and termination for employees who do not comply. The law also ties some university funding to compliance.

    DeSantis has said he wants to prevent the state’s colleges and universities from becoming “hotbeds for stale ideologies” and from developing “intellectually repressive environments.”
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Informative Informative x 1
  2. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer VIP Member

    16,837
    5,779
    3,213
    Oct 30, 2017
    Some of the nonsense is definitely getting struck down. The "Stop Woke Act" (HB7) when applied to higher education brazenly violates the First Amendment's Free Speech Clause. But ultimately, we're going to lose a lot of talent from the state. Academics can go elsewhere and not have to worry about a wannabe authoritarian governor and his lackeys retaliating against them if they use their First Amendment rights.

    If you want an example of the absurdity of HB7, here's an easy hypothetical. Imagine a student is in a constitutional law class at UF Law and the professor has just taught the Supreme Court's affirmative action jurisprudence.
    Law Student: "Professor Smith, do you think California v. Bakke was correctly decided?"
    Professor Answer #1: "Yes, I do think it was correctly decided. I think racial preferences are a good and important thing when trying to remedy our country's long history of discrimination."
    Professor Answer #2: "No, I think the case was wrongly decided. Discrimination is always bad, even when you're trying to atone for the sins of our past."

    Under the "Stop Woke Act," answer #1 violates the law and opens the professor up to being punished. Answer #2 does not violate the law. This is classic viewpoint discrimination, and it is an attempt by DeSantis and his lackeys to impose a "pall of orthodoxy over the classroom."

    You might ask why I phrased it that way. Keyishian v. Board of Regents, a SCOTUS case from 1967, is why:
    "Our Nation is deeply committed to safeguarding academic freedom, which is of transcendent value to all of us, and not merely to the teachers concerned. That freedom is therefore a special concern of the First Amendment, which does not tolerate laws that cast a pall of orthodoxy over the classroom. 'The vigilant protection of constitutional freedoms is nowhere more vital than in the community of American schools.' Shelton v. Tucker, supra at 364 U. S. 487. The classroom is peculiarly the 'marketplace of ideas.' The Nation's future depends upon leaders trained through wide exposure to that robust exchange of ideas which discovers truth 'out of a multitude of tongues, [rather] than through any kind of authoritative selection.'"

    Our universities deserve better. Our educators deserve better. Our students deserve better. And the people of Florida deserve better. Laws like HB7 are the work of smallminded, cowardly people. They are meant to appeal to those who revile education, fear critical thinking, and revel in ignorance.
     
    • Winner Winner x 6
    • Agree Agree x 4
    • Like Like x 1
    • Best Post Ever Best Post Ever x 1
  3. 108

    108 Premium Member

    18,021
    1,196
    803
    Apr 3, 2007
    NYC
    The problem is, that is geographically most of Florida..
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  4. ncargat1

    ncargat1 VIP Member

    14,372
    6,288
    3,353
    Dec 11, 2009
    DeSantis is about to kill the only recruiting tool Napier has left. UF will go from a Top 5 public university to a bottom 5 shi-ite-hole that opposes free thinking and education (you know, the purpose for Universities) in no time.

    It is stunning and sad Floridians are overwhelmingly in support China-like rule in Florida.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Come On Man Come On Man x 2
  5. swampbabe

    swampbabe GC Hall of Fame

    3,678
    918
    2,643
    Apr 8, 2007
    Viera, FL
    What fun to live in 1930s Germany.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
  6. ajoseph

    ajoseph Premium Member

    6,865
    2,534
    2,998
    Jan 15, 2008
    Have you seen the construct of our current Court? I read the Constitution, and the word “classroom” does not appear within the text. So, therefore, Classrooms have no constitutional protection. It’s for the States ….
     
  7. jjgator55

    jjgator55 VIP Member

    6,198
    1,765
    2,043
    Apr 3, 2007
    Time for university educators to walk out before fall classes. When the universities shut down then players won’t be able to attend classes. When that happens they won’t be able to play in any games. College football in Florida will shut down and everyone will blame the professors for walking out instead of DeSantis and the Republican led Florida legislature.

    They don’t call it Flori-duh for nothing.
     
    • Come On Man Come On Man x 3
  8. Orange_and_Bluke

    Orange_and_Bluke Premium Member

    9,580
    2,225
    3,038
    Dec 16, 2015
    If only our governor was as smarty as you.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  9. dynogator

    dynogator VIP Member

    6,373
    318
    418
    Apr 9, 2007
    Florida's universities seem to be in good shape. Why is he trying to fix that which isn't broken?
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Agree Agree x 2
  10. jjgator55

    jjgator55 VIP Member

    6,198
    1,765
    2,043
    Apr 3, 2007
    Oh he’s obviously a smart guy, but like JEB! and Rick Scott he’s working to consolidate power by removing all checks and balances that stand in his way.
     
  11. jjgator55

    jjgator55 VIP Member

    6,198
    1,765
    2,043
    Apr 3, 2007
    This goes back to the Koch brothers and Soros. Both attaching conditions to their donations. DeSantis is just doing their bidding because Soros seems to be winning that battle.
     
  12. Trickster

    Trickster VIP Member

    9,847
    2,398
    3,233
    Sep 20, 2014
    It’s not just Floridians. When 70% of republicans across the country think the election is fraudulent, and when a handful of posters here give a come on man without discussion to every little post that offends their snowflake sensibilities, you can see where the country is headed. The world saw the same dynamics in a certain European country in the 1930’s.
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Come On Man Come On Man x 1
  13. Trickster

    Trickster VIP Member

    9,847
    2,398
    3,233
    Sep 20, 2014
    littlebluew
    [​IMG]
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Come On Man Come On Man x 1
  14. gatordavisl

    gatordavisl VIP Member

    31,785
    54,915
    3,753
    Apr 8, 2007
    northern MN
    Where ya at, Bluke? I thought you lived in Cali.
     
  15. Orange_and_Bluke

    Orange_and_Bluke Premium Member

    9,580
    2,225
    3,038
    Dec 16, 2015
    I’m in central Fl.
    Was out in Ca visiting recently though. Lol
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. mutz87

    mutz87 p=.06 VIP Member

    38,229
    33,866
    4,211
    Aug 30, 2014
    Fix has several definitions or uses. The more appropriate one is along the lines of *match-fixing* or the act of playing or officiating a match with the intention of achieving a pre-determined result.

    His is a sickening attack on academic freedom and the reason we have public universities.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
  17. mutz87

    mutz87 p=.06 VIP Member

    38,229
    33,866
    4,211
    Aug 30, 2014
    Do you honestly believe that in institutions created on a foundation of academic freedom and for the purpose of creating knowlege, 1a doesn't apply at all in the classroom because the constitution doesn't mention classroom? That this is just a state's rights thing and that gov's can just do as they want?

    Don't want to comment based on my perception of your posting history (though I will :) ), but I'm fairly certain that you're much more reasonable than the above comment indicates.
     
    • Wish I would have said that Wish I would have said that x 1
  18. ursidman

    ursidman VIP Member

    13,961
    22,583
    3,348
    Sep 27, 2007
    Bug Tussle NC
    I read that as tongue in cheek on his part. Hope so.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  19. mutz87

    mutz87 p=.06 VIP Member

    38,229
    33,866
    4,211
    Aug 30, 2014
    Thanks. Probably was and I just missed it. If so, apologies to @ajoseph
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2022
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  20. gator_lawyer

    gator_lawyer VIP Member

    16,837
    5,779
    3,213
    Oct 30, 2017
    Because DeSantis hates freedom of speech and thinks that allowing academic freedom at universities will lead to them putting out "socialists." Apparently, "conservatives" lack the mental fortitude to have their beliefs challenged and remain "conservative." (Personally, I don't believe that. But it should speak volumes that DeSantis does.)
    [​IMG]

    He's mocking the Republican Supreme "Court."
     
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2022
    • Fistbump/Thanks! Fistbump/Thanks! x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1