Supreme Court rules for coach whose prayers on football field raised questions about church-state se

There are players who said they felt pressured, do we just ignore their experiences and go with what the coach said?

 

I'm fine with this. Every day of the week a different denomination leads prayers. Native Americans, Norse, Wiccan, Hindu, Muslim, Jewish, Catholics (bring rosaries for all), Evangelicals, etc. Heck players can have a Santera come and sacrifice a chicken or a goat prior to the game for luck.

And I'm nearly out of my "alloted" time but this wasn't a little prayer. Apparently left out of the decision was the part where this was a spectacle to where even band members were getting trampled for folks joining in Coach's prayer.

Because nothing says Christ's love more than making yourself a spectacle. Wasn't there some kind of teaching about this? That prayer was your way to connect & be with God and not a "look at me look at me, look at how much I pray" time?

I leave you with this.

 

I've literally posted excerpts from the record that contradict what you're saying. Yet, I'm the one "projecting"? Uh huh.

And your Free Exercise rights are limited when you're on duty as a government employee.

 

Absolutely. Amazing how blatant his team has been in dissembling the actual facts

 

We should all be afraid of a document conceived by slave masters who's heads would explode if they saw an airplane or indoor plumbing

 

I don't support it from a right/wrong sense, but I'm not losing any sleep over what our constitution allows. I believe God's law trumps mans law, but Gods law also tells me to honor earthly ordinance. (I e. The constitution) so I am not going to make this a fighting point.

Marriage is between people and God. The states sanctioned tax of a marriage license isnt really something I give a flip about and only have one myself because the law requires it for my wife and kids to have equal protection if something happens to me. (No common law exists in this state).

 

I have read up... And performative as you call ot is a requirement of the "religion". Christians are not to keep their "religion" to ourselves. It is supposed to be performative. Now I will say that IF he is doing it for show than he is violating scripture himself. But we don't know his heart, but the right has to be preserved because free exercise isnt limited to the shadows

 

Didn't want to start its own thread and think this is relevant to discussions of church and state. Boebert has a primary today.

Lauren Boebert says the church should direct government, days after SCOTUS overturns abortion rights

“The church is supposed to direct the government. The government is not supposed to direct the church,” Boebert told the crowd, which applauded. “I’m tired of this separation of church and state junk.”

(Emphasis added).

 

To some (minority) of you, free exercise means in the dark shadows with duct tape over our mouths. You will deny it with your keyboard but you know it's true.

Imagine if I forced a gay man to live in the shadows, would you consider him free to exercise who he is?

No. Public faith is a cornerstone of our democracy and the 1st amendment.

Don't fight for a transgender teacher to speak freely about who they are, than tell a Christian teacher that they can not.

If i say that a transgender teacher should hide their true self in the shadows quietly, you will call me a bigot, but if you say a Christian should hide their true self in the shadows you think of yourself as righteous.

Your hypocrisy is so obvious and you cant see it because your hatred to people different than you has clouded your view just like the racist or homophobes you condemn.

 

So you might say Christians are gay for Jesus

 

Ha, my religion REQUIRES I perform it for those that don’t subscribe to it. How convenient.

 

You go on these ridiculous rants without considering the nuance in the discussion or even recognizing that we have more than just the Free Exercise Clause to deal with here. The Establishment Clause exists. You want to run rampant over other people's freedom FROM religion out of your belief that free exercise is the more important right.

Let me be very clear on this. I don't think a Christian teacher should have to hide who they are. I don't think a transgender teacher should have to hide who they are. I also don't think the Christian teacher or the transgender teacher has the right to speak freely about who they are WHILE ON THE JOB.

When you accept employment with the government, you accept that while on the job, your rights are limited. The government, like a private employer, has the right to control its employees.

A Christian in public school cannot stop math class to proselytize about the gospel. A gay teacher cannot stop history class to talk about his sex life with the class. A transgender teacher cannot stop science class to go into a long discussion on gender-affirming care and transitioning. They have a job to do. Like any other employee, they don't have the right to speak freely without consequences.

 

Seems like its only fair to allow gays to perform their "belief" about being gay by being able to have gay sex with Christians anytime they want

 

But what if the trans teacher had a religious mandate to share the glory of The Change, especially with those whose puppy eyes are not yet open?

 

My second favorite part of this post, after the actual point, is the syntax multitasking in the second half.

 

My favorite part of these threads is how 'religious freedom' is just Calvinball for Christians doing whatever the hell they want anywhere

 

No. But we require more than "feelings". Someones feelings dont deny me my constitutional right.

Its amazing that here in NC people were condemned for "feeling" concern over the legalizing of men in women's showers by the same people who want to punish this coach based on a couple kids "feeling" pressure.

Several here weren't concerned about feeling in the Charlotte bathroom/shower case, but now they suddenly care about feelings.

 

Seems like the court just ruled to protect a guys feelings after he was told to stop doing something, no evidence required. They basically lied about the facts of the case in the opinion too. They had to invent new ones!

 

It's cute how you think you dont go on rants counselor.

I said it was a MINORITY of people that I was aiming my "rediculous rant" at.

 

The problem comes in when you are an agent of govt it isn’t just about you and your touchy feelings or your personal belief system. You have a job to accomplish, and laws to follow regardless of your beliefs, or possibly even despite of them. If you leave parts of the public job to “personal beliefs” you end up with a nutter like Kim Davis illegally refusing marriage licenses because of her “personal beliefs”.

I’m guessing most of you would be aghast if those “personal beliefs” were sharia law or something outside Christian orthodoxy. Free exercise of religion means religious beliefs need to be accommodated and respected, it doesn’t mean others need to bend to the religious whims of any one person, particularly when that person is an agent of govt. This is the mistake Christian fundamentalists consistently make when they side for “religious freedom” in cases such as this, and they do it at their own peril because it isn’t as if all Christian sects are in agreement or likely to live in peace and harmony. The founders recognized this in the constitution, which is the basis of our religious liberties in this country. The colonies were founded by people escaping religious oppression! Many may have been Christians, but they were also fleeing the oppression of other Christians. As were many of our early settlers (both pre and post American revolution). It’s like some of y’all forgot or are clueless about these most basic principles.

The football coach doesn’t have to hide in the shadows, and im guessing he’s in an area where it’s majority Christian (so the idea he’s being oppressed is patently absurd) but as a public school official it sounded like he went a little more coercive in organizing this hoping to groom some of his students into his religion… and it made some uncomfortable. What about their rights? Prayer circles happen all the time and don’t go to court, so obviously something was different here in terms of his position and the type of coercion he was applying to make the religious expression not exactly voluntary.